The Final Price of Paradise Radio Show
Price of Paradise · Hawaii Public Radio · aired 1998-08-23
Guests: Ann (Caller); Dana (Caller); Daniel (Caller); David (Caller); Dick (Caller); Dr. Morris (Caller); Jay (Caller); Jim (Caller); Joe (Caller); Larry (Caller); Lloyd (Caller); Lola (Caller); Lucienne (Caller); Nancy (Caller); Nick (Caller); Peter (Caller); Peter Adler (Caller); Ruth (Caller); Sean (Caller); Susie Roth (Producer); Tom (Caller)
Duration: 01:04:40

[00:00:03] Randall Roth: Aloha. This is Randy Roth, host of the Price of Paradise show. Usually, I would say now that everyone who works on this show is a volunteer who believes in the importance of lively, informed dialogue, and I would talk about the marketplace of ideas and how important it is to have a lot of activity there, etc. But that's a lot of what we're going to be talking about during the next hour. And so I'll just tell you this is our last show, at least until after the election and and maybe for good.
[00:00:33] Randall Roth: We've really enjoyed doing this show. We hope that a number of people have enjoyed it or learned a thing or two along the way. Our decision to discontinue the show has not been an easy one, and it certainly wasn't one that we saw coming until fairly recently.
[00:00:52] Randall Roth: During today's show, I'm going to do my best to explain our decision and why we've made it. Then we're going to take some calls and hopefully, we'll hear a lot of things from listeners, whether it's about what we've tried to accomplish on the show or some of their favorite shows, our reason for discontinuing the show or anything else related to what we're going to be talking about is fair game. If what's happened this last week is any indication, I think the call-in part of this show should be interesting if nothing else.
[00:01:24] Randall Roth: Bottom line is that Susie and I, Susie's my wife and the producer of this show, we've volunteered to help in Linda Lingle's campaign for governor, and in order to do that, we have to free up some time and the only adjustment that we could make in our lives that made any sense to us was to discontinue the show and then apply the time that we've been putting into it into the campaign for Linda Lingle.
[00:01:51] Randall Roth: Also, it seemed to us that we've enjoyed a reputation of being nonpartisan up until now. Now that we're working for Linda Lingle, I think people are going to quite naturally wonder about why we picked a particular topic or a particular guest or why a certain question was asked, that sort of thing, and we understand that. And so, for a variety of reasons, we think it's it's necessary for us to discontinue the show.
[00:02:18] Randall Roth: It may be that after the election, it will be possible for us to regain our nonpartisan image or maybe we could restructure the show into a point counterpoint, sort of format where maybe somebody who's perceived as being partisan in a different way could join me and we could um uh talk to guests together. I'm not sure. But one thing that is certain is that you're not going to be hearing any more live broadcasts at least involving Susie and me until at least after the election.
[00:02:52] Randall Roth: Jeff Alardi out there has been our super duper technician for many, many years. Jeff is still here on the staff at Hawaii Public Radio, but has put in many, many, many hours as a volunteer helping with this show, Price of Paradise. If you would like to ask a question or to make a comment, again, if it relates to what we've been trying to do and I'll hopefully explain that a bit more in a few minutes, but anything about what we've tried to do with Price of Paradise or the decision we've made, what we described as the reason for the decisions, anything like that, we welcome your call.
[00:03:31] Randall Roth: The number is 955-8821. If you're on a neighbor island, it's 1-800-955-8821. Why did we do it? Well, I guess, number one, Susie and I are just real concerned about the future of Hawaii, and certainly we're not unique in in that respect, but we as we look ahead feel that unless there's fairly major change and fairly quickly, the future of this wonderful place that we call home is not nearly as bright as has been its past. We're concerned about what's going on here in terms of its impact on the quality of life today, but we're more concerned about the implications of where we're headed.
[00:04:17] Randall Roth: We're more concerned about the impact that all of this is going to have on future generations. We've worked hard to get to know each of the candidates and their records, what they've done, what they say they're going to do. And for us at least, it's become a fairly easy call. We feel fairly strongly, Susie and I, that Linda Lingle is what Hawaii needs right now. We feel that she's the only candidate who is in a position to really step forward and make the kind of change that Hawaii needs.
[00:04:52] Randall Roth: To us at least, we see her as intelligent and energetic, somebody [unintelligible — audio glitch] integrity, somebody who's independent, a person who doesn't owe anybody for anything and is in and is in a position to really make decisions uh based on on the merits of the individuals and the issues themselves, uh as opposed to being burdened by any kind of of baggage. I I suppose to kind of appreciate how difficult this process has been for us and why it took us so long to uh get involved in a particular campaign. You've got to know that that neither Susie nor I have ever been involved in a campaign. We both have disliked party politics, partisan politics.
[00:05:41] Randall Roth: Um I've always been [unintelligible — audio glitch] black sheep in that respect, I suppose, in my family. I come from a very politically active family. My mother was chairperson of the Democratic Party in our home county. One of my brothers was elected and re-elected a number of times as a Democrat to the state legislature. I have another brother who directed a number of successful campaigns for democratic politicians, and he's a lawyer. He represents uh public worker unions. And so I grew up around a very active, politically active family. But for me at least, it just wasn't something that I was interested in in getting involved with.
[00:06:22] Randall Roth: Up until about 10 years ago, I was perfectly content to simply pay attention to the issues and vote my conscience, but that was about it. For me at least, the change started in the late '80s when I was appointed to the Tax Review Commission here in Hawaii. Um I went into this really quite enthusiastic. Hawaii is unique in that our constitution mandates that periodically a group of people with different types of expertise will take a close look at the tax system and then make recommendations for improvement to make it more fair, or more efficient, or in some way a better system from the people's standpoint.
[00:07:07] Randall Roth: My experience on the Tax Review Commission opened my eyes in a variety of ways. The first wake-up call I suppose was the way the governor at that time approached it, uh cramming down our throats an individual to uh serve as executive director, who was the nicest person in the world, but just not at all equipped to assist us in that way. Um looking back on it, I think it was an attempt to do someone a favor. I think it had to do with what was then called the high three.
[00:07:40] Randall Roth: I also, again looking back at it, am pretty sure that his primary function was to keep an eye on us and report back to the governor. It just didn't seem like a very productive way to approach the task. But wake-up call number two was when after thousands of hours as a group put into coming up with recommendations, we went to the legislature and found that instead of the lively informed dialogue that I had anticipated, we were virtually ignored. I personally was just shocked by the level of arrogance.
[00:08:16] Randall Roth: I still remember a particular committee chair dismissing us as if we had such audacity to suggest change without first asking him exactly what sort of change we should be suggesting. And wake-up call number three in this respect was when I tried to get the media to delve into this and to report what was going on, I found a group of people that struck me at least as being fairly cynical. And what it amounted to was that they kind of laughed at me that I would be shocked that a group of people would recommend change and uh find that the political leadership at that time would would be very resistant to it.
[00:08:59] Randall Roth: At any rate, that's what led to the writing of the Price of Paradise books. And the Price of Paradise books were intended to generate lively informed dialogue, to increase the activity in our marketplace of ideas. And that led to our Pop '94 attempt to quote elevate the 1994 campaign for governor, and the Price of Paradise Radio Show we've been doing for about five years. And to us at least, this generation of lively informed dialogue is real important. We think anytime you've got a one party state, regardless of which party it is, you're going to have a a monopoly of sorts.
[00:09:41] Randall Roth: There's going to be a tendency not to encourage dialogue, not to encourage debate, not to really seriously consider uh any sort of substantial change. Well, again, folks, that's just some of the background so far as why we did the show in the first place. And if you tuned in late, the bottom line on all of this is that the show's producer, my wife, Susie, and I have decided that we need to take the time that we've been putting into this particular endeavor, the Price of Paradise Radio Show, and use it to support Linda Lingle for governor. There's an old Chinese proverb that words don't cook rice and that resonates for us right now.
[00:10:24] Randall Roth: We feel like words are wonderful, ideas are terribly important, but there comes a point in time for each individual, or in in our case, the two of us, where we feel a need to take it another step and try to um to actually help in accomplishing some change. Well, we've got a few people on the line. We've got a couple more open lines, so please feel free to call us at 955-8821. But first, we have Nancy and I can't even read it. Is from Puna?
[00:10:56] Nancy: Nancy, are you there?
[00:10:57] Randall Roth: Yes, I am. Are you from Puna?
[00:10:59] Nancy: Yes.
[00:11:00] Randall Roth: Good morning.
[00:11:01] Nancy: Hi there. I'm really sad to hear this is ending. I just wanted to know that right off. Is your website going to stay on?
[00:11:08] Randall Roth: I think so. We're we're looking for someone to take care of that, to keep it up to date and hopefully continue to expand it, but we don't yet have that worked out.
[00:11:21] Nancy: I see. Uh, but the question that's been bothering me all along is you know how it goes being somebody who studies things that if the premise is wrong, then the whole argument from it is like poison fruit. You can't nothing is right, right?
[00:11:36] Randall Roth: That's right.
[00:11:38] Nancy: Well, what about the premise of stuffing all these people onto this small patches of land out here in the middle of nowhere, in isolated islands. Most isolated islands populated islands in the world. How can we keep stuffing people onto these little bits of land and not do anything about that and then go on and on and on complaining about everything else that goes wrong.
[00:12:02] Nancy: I really like to hear that discussed before you're gone off the air, because every time I tried to bring that up to the politicians whenever I had a chance to ask questions at forums and so forth, all I get is dissed off. Nobody wants to deal with the subject. They just won't discuss it. Oh, it's unconstitutional, they say. You can't think about it. Baloney. If you set policy in certain ways, people come or they don't come or they are attracted or they aren't attracted. Individuals still self-select. You don't have to make things mandatory. But policy and and economics can deal with that to a great extent. So can the pulpit.
[00:12:38] Randall Roth: Well, Nancy, Provided we are realistic. Nancy, I'm going to take all of that as as a very eloquent comment and I guess all I would say is that it sounds like you've got a lot of passion and energy behind your thoughts, and I think that that's what makes a democracy work.
[00:12:55] Randall Roth: I think that if we can get more people stirred up whether it's about one issue that you see as the premise to everything else, or even if somebody sees just a little piece of the big puzzle puzzle, if we can get people as stirred up as you and and expressing themselves as well as you do, I personally think that even though a lot of times we're going to disagree with one another, I personally think that that's what gives us a bright future.
[00:13:20] Nancy: Okay. Well, what about dealing with the actual issue itself? When are we going to be able to discuss it on the in public, debate it on the air, and actually listen to the ideas?
[00:13:30] Randall Roth: Yeah, well, one one possible answer is for you to to try to figure out how to do that, whether it's to schedule whether it's to schedule a a little program uh, you know, off off in the the corner of Puna, where you don't have media coverage or what I've tried real hard to do over the last five or six years is to get the media very involved in the conversations that I've been putting together. And I'll tell you it's not easy, but it is it is doable, and I I encourage you to to give it a shot.
[00:14:02] Nancy: Well, out here in Puna, in fact a good part of the Big Island, that's just like preaching to the choir. Everybody I talk to goes, yeah, yeah, of course. What else is there to talk about? Well, because everybody leaves that over here, but I don't see how that um translates to anything I see in public about what our public servants and our public officials and our public economic leadership even taking any attention to it all. Fact they are the whole idea of even mentioning the subject.
[00:14:27] Randall Roth: It sounds like you and I are in agreement that we need change. Uh we may not agree as to which candidate or which direction, but we certainly agree. We agree to the need for change. So, Nancy, I appreciate your call. We're going to have to move on, but I I thank you.
[00:14:41] Nancy: Well, thank you so much for your show, Randy. It's really been a breath of fresh air, and the only one I can get sometimes.
[00:14:46] Randall Roth: Thank you so much. Thank you, Nancy. Bye-bye. We go to Ruth in Makiki. Good morning, Ruth.
[00:14:52] Ruth: Randy, I'm very troubled. I've delayed many Sunday mornings going for an early morning swim to watch Price of Paradise because I felt it was fair, open, and very very stimulating. But I'm really troubled that you use your last program as a political speech for a candidate. It kind of blocks out in my mind the fairness that I've always thought you stood for. And I think I have to say this because I think there are ways to bring out differences and needs for change than using the bully platform of public radio for a last minute call for a particular candidate. I'm really troubled, and that's all I can say.
[00:15:39] Randall Roth: Ruth, would you like to say anything on behalf of another candidate?
[00:15:43] Ruth: No, I consider I'm an independent. And if I don't like what a particular party is doing, I work my head off to make changes within that party. I don't I don't go for another candidate who doesn't have a record, except a lot of beautiful voice and lovely rhetoric. And I am an independent, and until recent years, I have registered as an independent. And I'm just really troubled. I've loved Price of Paradise and I'm very very sad.
[00:16:13] Randall Roth: Well, I I appreciate your call and and I don't I don't want to sound defensive. What I've tried to do is simply explain why it is that we're discontinuing the show, and I don't know how to explain that without saying that Susie and I have decided to to work for Linda Lingle and
[00:16:29] Ruth: Well, I I've heard every word you said, and I know you're very sincere. I just have real doubts about this kind of approach to things. Okay. And that's all.
[00:16:38] Randall Roth: Well, I I really appreciate your calling in. I think it's uh
[00:16:42] Ruth: Well, it's not easy for me to do this.
[00:16:44] Randall Roth: You know, [unintelligible — audio glitch] hard, especially uh when you kind of feel like you like someone and you've enjoyed this show. It's it's hard to be honest with him when you disagree, but I think that's a lot of of what we need more of here in Hawaii. I attended a a meeting the other day and I don't want to be too specific because it would identify some individuals and the circumstances are such that that I I just they they don't deserve to be named. But um we had people who were in a position to tell a high-level official in Hawaii some things that he really needed to hear.
[00:17:23] Randall Roth: They said absolutely nothing and then after the meeting, they were telling me all of these things that were of terrific importance, but they just didn't want to say it because it was so critical. To me, you've got to be honest about that stuff. You've been honest with me, Ruth, and I really appreciate it.
[00:17:39] Ruth: Yeah, well, I've seen your program as a way to get differences out, and that is the thing the way I think problems are solved. Not by using public radio as a bully pulpit, and I have to stop now.
[00:17:52] Randall Roth: Okay. Thank you very much. I appreciate your call. Well, I think anyone who wondered whether we really needed to discontinue doing this show now that we've uh decided to support a candidate, I think you've you've got an an excellent explanation from someone as to why that's inappropriate from this point on. David on Maui, good morning.
[00:18:14] David: Aloha, Randy. Uh, thank you, and and I'm going to miss this program also. I uh really appreciated the different viewpoints and such. Um first, I have a question is as what is your political view of the sovereignty movement? If you um or Linda are uh less left with the um the the votes to get in office, what will happen if uh the sovereignty uh movement happens with um constitutional referendum or uh maybe uh just the empowerment of the natives and and the uh land issue? Uh, what what is
[00:19:00] Randall Roth: your opinion on that?
[00:19:02] David: Well, you know, David, I don't want this show to become a forum for my own opinions on on these important issues and I would simply say I think what we'll call the sovereignty discussion is one of, if not the single most important conversation that this state needs to have, and I personally don't think that the public conversation of of sovereignty is nearly as productive as it needs to be. And I'm hopeful that in some way, whether it comes from political leadership, or it comes from the Hawaiian community, or it comes from everybody in this state, I'm hopeful that somehow or another we're going to figure out a way to have a more constructive dialogue, one that brings the various elements of this state together as opposed to pushes them apart. Um, so other than to to say I I share what evidently is your belief that this is important issue. Uh, it's it's too big a topic for me to sit here and start detailing my own thoughts on it.
[00:20:11] Randall Roth: I understand that. Appreciate that. Um, I just like to say that I think that this movement is a international movement that's happening for all uh conscious people to wake up and have personal rights and public uh um civil rights. And uh I also would like to ask one real question, legal question before I go. And that is um you mentioned that we live in a democracy and uh I just wonder if you could clarify that because uh it it looks to me like in the constitution, it says that this is a a republic. Uh I know we're supposed to pledge to the flag in that manner, the flag of the republic for which it stands, and I just wondered if you could clarify that a little bit.
[00:20:56] Randall Roth: Clarify what?
[00:20:57] David: Is this a democracy, a republic, or a democratic republic? Uh, because there is a difference and it's a big difference and uh I I think it's a misnomer to call a democracy. I don't think that's what we were looking for in a just form of society.
[00:21:11] Randall Roth: Okay. Well, I without getting into a civics lesson and and I'm sure you understand that we vote for representatives and those representatives of the people make a lot of important decisions. But, I think your your question was really a comment, David, and we'll take it as such and I appreciate your call this morning. Okay. We need to have rights for the poor and for the minority. That's what a a republic is. A democracy is the power by by the majority. I I hear what I hear what you're saying, David. That's the difference. Okay. Aloha. Thank you. Thank you. We go to Tom from Manoa. Good morning, Tom.
[00:21:44] Tom: Hi, I actually got two questions. Mhm. Um. First regarding Linda Lingle's stand on welfare. A few months ago, I think it was the Star bulletin quoted her and I think I've got this straight. Uh welfare is a concept that no one should believe in. Later, uh in the recent Honolulu magazine, she seems to have modified her view. Where does she stand on welfare? Okay, that's my first question.
[00:22:08] Randall Roth: Oh, Tom, and I'm going to come back to you and let you ask your second question. Uh I think it's important that this show not become uh a forum for my trying to sell Linda Lingle to you or or to anybody else. Um by by way of of information, it's it's my understanding [unintelligible — audio glitch] quote that you gave is is incomplete. It's it's my understanding that what she was talking to talking about as as being bad was was the idea that that welfare would be a a lifestyle, that it would be something that would be more than what it was originally intended to be, but again, I really don't think this is the time to get into um uh especially since we don't have another voice supporting another candidate. I tried to get somebody a high profile active person in in Ben Cayetano's campaign to write a companion piece to something that I wrote for the advertiser that that didn't run this morning because I couldn't um uh it just didn't come together. Some weeks these things work and sometimes they don't, but this show isn't happening quite the way that I had envisioned it, but I think it's still serving a purpose, but it's important that I not sit here and simply uh sing the praises of the candidate that I've decided to support.
[00:23:33] Tom: Okay. No no problem. I I hesitated to ask that question because I didn't know what direction you were going in. But my second question and maybe this is one you care not to answer either. I just finished reading uh Land and Power in Hawaii by Daws and Cooper, right? Yes. Okay, frightening the way the Democrats got in bed with the big boys. Linda Lingle is a Republican. The Republicans used to be in bed with the big boys in Hawaii. The republic, the typical traditional Republican stance is to be in bed with the big corporations. How do we know Linda Lingle won't do that? Now, you don't have to answer that because I know the answer has to be partisan.
[00:24:11] Randall Roth: Well, I don't think it does I don't think it does, Tom. I personally feel strongly that a two-party system is important. I I personally feel strongly that whether it's the Republican party that has absolute control, which they had for many, many years, or the Democratic party, which has had absolute control for a long times, I personally think that even though you got very very good people, well-intentioned people, hardworking people in whichever the two parties it might be that has control, there's something about a monopoly like that that to me, at least, is counterproductive as circumstances change and a state needs to change with them. When you've got a group of people who have that much power, I think there's going to be a natural tendency to resist change. I think there's going to be a natural tendency to hang on to what it is that gives them power, and I say that whether it's the Republicans or the Democrats or some other group. Okay, I hear you. Thanks very much.
[00:25:14] Dick: Yes, we're going to miss you and your wife and team. You've done really a good job and I think it's great the way you brought most sides to sensitive issues in a very positive, constructive way. But I share a little bit the concern of the last speaker. When I see what the Republicans are doing in Washington with the with Newt his crew, and Trent Lott, I wonder how a socially sensitive well-brought-a-person like you can support a Republican when I agree we do need a two-party system, but can't we get some good Republicans? Can't we you maybe be a reformer of their old ways and be sensitive to people concerns as well as making money?
[00:26:03] Randall Roth: Let me um respond to that in a couple of different ways. One is that one reason I haven't liked party politics in the past is that it seems to me there are a lot of Republicans who think that that all Democrats are not just misguided, but they're they're almost evil, that that their intentions are bad or or that they're just uh um bad people in some way. And I think there are a lot of Democrats that feel the same sort of way about Republicans and to me at least, that's really counterproductive. Um a second way to respond to to what Dick is saying is that I don't feel like I'm putting my name on the line supporting the Republican candidate or the Republican party. Um I'm supporting Linda Lingle, and if if she were a member of the Democratic party, quite frankly, I would be supporting her. Even though I believe strongly in a two-party system. I just happen to think that she is the individual that we need right now to make the kind of changes that need to be made. She's a very moderate Republican, and Ben Cayetano is a very moderate Democrat. I think they're not very far apart in terms of their specific ideas. To me, it's a question of who for a variety of reasons is best positioned to actually make the changes that I think we need to make. So, I don't know Dick. I I hear what you're saying. I certainly grew up in a family of of Democrats and and I can appreciate what you're saying. Um, at the same time, that's where I've ended up.
[00:27:44] Dick: Well, thanks again and I do hope you return and continue your work for all people. Thank you very much.
[00:28:07] Randall Roth: Okay, thank you, Dick. You know, and so some of my friends don't get the wrong impression, I grew up in a family of Democrats, but uh, but I had the most conservative instincts of anyone in that family, and so they're not the least bit surprised that uh, that a candidate that I would be supporting would be a moderate Republican as opposed to uh, uh, a Democrat. We go to Lloyd in Waikiki. Good morning, Lloyd. Aloha. Aloha. Well, I just hope that uh whoever gets into the office, um, since this is a bully puppet here, deal, uh will at least answer their phone Aloha. You know, I got a resolution through the state, through the legislature, that all governmental offices will answer the phone Aloha. In the meantime, I call Governor Cayetano, he's still saying good morning and good afternoon. I don't know what Lingle's stand is on this, but I hope that whoever gets to be the the uh, Governor of this state will at least respect the fact that we still have this is the Aloha state and we should answer the phone Aloha, and we should have more Aloha mentioned instead of just trying to develop things and trying to be hardcore like the mainland. I think this is such a beautiful place that not, let's not grind it down to another mainland figures and facts and there's a spiritual thing here and it's spirit.
[00:29:07] Randall Roth: Lloyd, I appreciate your call and I appreciate all the aloha that was inherent in what you said and how you said it.
[00:29:14] Lloyd: All right. Thank you so much, Randy. You are the best of everything.
[00:29:17] Randall Roth: Thank you so much. Aloha. Aloha. You know, as I was listening to Lloyd, and I'm not sure why I made this connection, but in terms of of a good news statistics, statistic, I've heard from a couple different people and and read in the Star Bulletin the other night that voter registration is way up by over 100,000 new voter registrants, it strikes me as a very good sign that we've got so many more people wanting to be able to cast a ballot. I'm optimistic that we're going to have a a high turnout this year as compared to past years. And regardless of who wins, I think that's a real good sign in terms of of where this state, uh perhaps, is headed. Let's go to Jay on Oahu. Good morning, Jay.
[00:30:03] Jay: Good morning. Hi, I I'm I just got to say I've enjoyed the the last few comments, especially that guy saying aloha.
[00:30:11] Randall Roth: He calls once in a while and there's just something in the way he says it that it brightens my morning.
[00:30:15] Jay: Yes, yes. What a great way. Well, uh, I'm kind of a new listener to your show. I I've only caught it a few times since, um, I've come here to Oahu. I'm actually from another island. And I just wanted to say what a way to wake up in the morning, uh, stimulated conversation going on, but when I heard you kind of signing off, you know, this my last show and all that stuff, and your reasons for doing it. I just wanted to call and say, I, you know, I can respect that. Uh, I used to be in radio as well. And wanting to you know, being in, in, in that field, and you have a lot of disinformation about what's going on in the community going on, you want to get involved, you want to put your opinions out there, um, sort of, um, kind of bring it all together, but you can't do it, when you're in that media, unless you take one side or the other.
[00:34:16] Jay: left that field so that I can voice voice my opinion, so to speak. And I kind of, I'm kind of looking forward to speaking my piece a little more than I have in the past.
[00:34:26] Randall Roth: Yes, yes. And instead of having to walk that fine line all the time because you don't want to offend anybody, and you need to allow everybody that, that right to believe what they uh, believe and and support whatever they want to support without using your uh, for lack of better words, power, I guess, in the media to influence, you know? And, and I just wanted to call and and congratulate you for that. Uh I'm I'm not doing anything actively with community. It's uh, back to taking care of things in my life before I can even begin to think about that. But I appreciate that. I just wanted to tell you that.
[00:35:01] Randall Roth: Jay, I appreciate your call.
[00:35:03] Jay: All right. Thank you so much.
[00:35:05] Randall Roth: Okay. Bye-bye.
[00:35:09] Sean: Oh, hello. Um, I was really here, I was really sad to hear that the price of paradise is going off because I just want you to know that I called your show many times and it's so wonderful that I I can express my opinion and my viewpoint and get my feelings off my chest the way you did. You've been very polite and taking my my calls and stuff. Maybe my views maybe been a little bit extreme from time to time, but, um, you know, you've been really wonderful and I just wanted to let you know that. Um, the second, uh, the second thing is, uh, just real quick is, uh, I am supporting Linda Lingle because I have been totally alienated by the Cayetano administration. I did vote for Cayetano in 94. I'm one of those Caucasians that will not vote for him this year. So, he's going to have to deal with it. Um, I'm not saying that the the mess that went on in Hawaii is Cayetano's fault, but he could have shown leadership. He had four years to do it. Uh, he has failed. Not only he's failed, the man's in denial, but uh I'm not going to tie you up anymore, but I just, mostly I just want to say thank you.
[00:36:07] Randall Roth: Okay, thank you, Sean. You know, Sean said sometimes his position's extreme. I I happen to be a a moderate, I guess, and these labels are all terribly misleading. But I believe strongly that you need extreme voices from a lot of different directions, that somehow or another, if they're not part of that mix, as a conversation is is held in a community, that you just don't get where you need to go. And so um, even though I'm a moderate, I I really love to hear people who are out on the fringe, regardless of which side they're on. Uh, it always makes me think about things a little bit more clearly than I did before.
[00:36:42] Randall Roth: Let's go to Peter Adler, my old friend, uh from Manoa. Good morning, Peter.
[00:36:48] Peter: Peter, are you there? Oh, no. We lost Peter. Well, Peter, if you could call back, that would be great. In case you tuned in late, you're listening to the Price of Paradise Radio Show. My name is Randy Roth and we're taking calls, 955-8821. My son, Tom, is out there on the phone, Susie's going to join me here in the studio in just a little bit. We are having our last show. Actually, there may be a live broadcast next week. I think we've got one. We have a show that we had set up a long time ago, but we're scurrying around trying to figure out how best to do this, and I think probably it will be with a substitute host, and we'll maybe just help in in a variety of other ways. We don't want our uh having committed to a particular candidate to somehow taint the way our conversation next week is per- perceived. So, we're going to have a live show next week, we're pretty sure. Uh after that, we'll do some rebroadcasts, but um, that having been said, this is it, folks, and if you'd like to call in and say anything about what we've been doing with this show or not doing uh that we should have been doing with this show, or my explanation as to what we're doing and why.
[00:38:00] Randall Roth: or anything else, our number is 955-8821 or 1-800-955-8821. Well, I'm not sure who's next up. Did we get Peter back? No, we go to Ann from Nu'uanu. Good morning, Ann.
[00:38:15] Ann: Yeah, good morning, Randy. My first thought is I'm sorry to hear that you are leaving the airwaves but on the other hand I'm glad that you are pursuing a change for this place. Because I think Hawaii is like a rock, and thrown into the water, and it's sinking to the bottom, and I don't know how much farther it's got to go. But I'm like a rat. I'm getting my affairs in order and ready to move to the mainland next year because I can't take any more of this. Hawaii was once a beautiful place, and what has happened to it, I think is outrageous, and it takes strong people like you to to get something done. And you know, the public radio talks about not getting many contributions, right? And if the economy was better, maybe they would get more contributions, right?
[00:39:04] Randall Roth: Well, um clearly the stronger the economy, the better people are able to support charitable activities.
[00:39:11] Ann: But it's true, this rock, how much farther is it going to go before it hits the bottom?
[00:39:16] Randall Roth: Well, I hope we're not going to go any further down, and I hope that you reconsider your your decision to move.
[00:39:24] Ann: I'm a taxpayer, and see what's happening is taxpayers are leaving this this state. Taxpayers and potential taxpayers, and the people that are staying, the welfare loads are rising here. This is the only state where the welfare case loads are rising.
[00:39:40] Randall Roth: Well and and obviously there are there are a number of reasons for that but I can just say, Suzie and I gave very serious thought sometime back to to moving and we decided that we wanted this to be our home and that we wanted to work to change things rather than to um to go elsewhere. And I just I just hope you and other people who are thinking about leaving, um reconsider it because it's it's the people of Hawaii that that makes us want to stay, and and we've we've seen too many people leave for the mainland, but we certainly understand um, you know, the forces at work here.
[00:40:16] Ann: It's it's tough times here and it takes tough people, I guess, and and you're one of them and I guess I'm not tough enough. I don't know, but I really do appreciate what you've done. I and I liked our book, she wrote. Yeah, I hope you get something together after the election, and uh, we'll just see what happens. But I hope that rock doesn't sink much farther.
[00:40:37] Randall Roth: I do too. Thank you, Ann. We go to uh Jim from Hawaii Kai. Good morning, Jim.
[00:40:45] Jim: Yeah, this is Jim King.
[00:40:47] Randall Roth: Hi, Jim.
[00:40:48] Jim: Say look, Randy. Uh you know you're on public radio and uh you've been proselytizing and and uh the Republican program, letters of Linda Lingle. You've mentioned her name God knows how many times already. Don't you realize there is a public radio station, which is supposed to be nonpartisan, you don't do that sort of thing. I think if you had half a brain you would have realized that. And if you have a grain of decency in you, you'd get off the the air right now.
[00:41:20] Randall Roth: Well, I appreciate your call, Jim. I really do.
[00:41:24] Jim: Well are you going to get off? Or are you going to keep on, and support your own, your candidate?
[00:41:30] Randall Roth: Well, Jim, I think we just disagree in terms of of what it is that I am doing. And um, I recognize that it's it's uh something that people can disagree on.
[00:41:41] Jim: Look, I've been a supporter of public radio ever since they began. And in my memory nothing like this has ever happened before. Like you say, you said something in the beginning of your uh episode here this morning that uh well, maybe Cayetano or the other party should have uh a representative and you're not going to get into certain things unless there is. Well that's exactly correct. You don't have any other opposing representative. You're a pro-Lingle person. You've just said that publicly. The bar got into a fuss about that and I can understand why. And now you're on public radio uh for a whole goddamn hour apparently, you're going to assault our ears about one side. One side and not uh the the selection of different points of view like you have in the past.
[00:42:36] Randall Roth: Well, Jim, again, I I appreciate your call. I really do. Um we we just disagree on this one, but thank you for calling.
[00:42:43] Jim: We sure do.
[00:42:44] Randall Roth: Okay. We go to Nick on Maui. Good morning, Nick.
[00:42:47] Nick: Nick, are you there?
[00:42:49] Nick: Yes, I'm here. Randy. Uh what am I going to do? I've had withdrawals on Friday night because Dialog is off the air. Now, I'm going to have withdrawals on Sunday morning because you're off the air. I want to really thank you for all the years uh that you've done this show. Um I would like to ask a question a bit of a comment, but a question. Um based a little bit on what a few people have said recently and your responses. In '94 Kioni Dudley and Frank Fasi both ran for governor. Uh this year, uh P-body, George P-body, is also running for governor. You've mentioned a few times that you've had it with the Democrats and, Cayetano, in particular, you're going to support Lingle. But basically the Democrats and Republicans are quite similar. A lot of Democrats are now supporting Lingle. Uh the same people that support the Republicans are supporting the Democrats. The comment was made a little earlier by a caller that, unfortunately, the Republican Party here, though it acts like a progressive party, is tied to the right-wing, etc, people on the mainland, and they really can't get away from that. So I just like you to comment a bit on your position when you talk about, you think it's really important to have a two-party system, why not a multi-party system?
[00:44:12] Randall Roth: Well, my statement was was quite uh boiled down from the way I really feel. I like lots of voices, lots of different voices. And I think the libertarians, and the greens, and and people that don't even have a a party name or designation add a a great deal to the mix. I didn't don't mean to suggest two as opposed to uh three or four or five, or what have you. And in many ways labels can be terribly misleading. I guess, two party system is just my quick way of suggesting that that I think uh we need a a little bit more competition in what I'll call the the marketplace of ideas and political thought. And I just think that sort of thing's healthy, but if your point is that we need to uh encourage the the libertarians and the greens, etc, I I agree completely.
[00:45:05] Nick: Randy, this is why I'm going to miss you because I appreciate your insight, sensitivity and your response. So, uh uh give a thought about returning uh after the election because this vehicle and this forum has really been a tremendous gift and benefit for the uh people of uh of uh Hawaii.
[00:45:26] Randall Roth: Okay. Thank you, Nick.
[00:45:27] Nick: Aloha.
[00:45:28] Randall Roth: Aloha. We go to oh we got Peter Adler back. Peter, are you there?
[00:45:32] Peter Adler: I'm here, Randy. How are you?
[00:45:34] Randall Roth: Sorry, sorry we we lost you.
[00:45:36] Peter Adler: That's all right.
[00:45:36] Randall Roth: In case people don't know, Peter is the Executive Director of the Hawaii Justice Foundation and uh a mediator extraordinaire and gosh, it would take a long time to tell people about you, Peter. But you've been as involved or more involved in different forms of civic activity uh than I have and what do you have to say?
[00:45:56] Peter Adler: Randy, first thing I want to do is on behalf of a lot of people just say thanks for for uh this enterprise and all the previous uh enterprises, the books, the website, all the good things that you've been doing on this and again part of the reason why I've been so proud to participate is because it is a major contribution to revitalizing the civic uh culture that we have here in Hawaii and have had at different times. And I guess that's the question that I thought I'd ask. Not so much about Lingle and Cayetano, but are we seeing a resurgence of civic vitality here? What's your take on that? What's your read? Uh is this one of those moments where things are going to start getting better, maybe not economically, but at least in terms of our civic vitality, our community involvement, our sense of participation? I'd love to hear you say offer your thoughts.
[00:46:41] Randall Roth: Well, just real quickly. I am I'm optimistic on that level and and maybe it's because things have gotten so bad here, whether you're looking at at the economy or or some other indicators. But um the fact that there are so many new people who have signed up to vote, I mentioned that earlier. I see that as a very positive indicator. Uh let me throw it back at you Peter, just real quickly. What are your thoughts? Are are we headed in the right direction so far as the level of civic activity is concerned?
[00:47:09] Peter Adler: I'm I'm worried that this is a little blip on the radar screen because it's a rough political period and there's a meaningful opposition that we're going to misconstrue that for uh civic vitality. Voting numbers isn't just the be-all and end-all of that. I've always thought that what we really need to do is create a governance structures below the county level, real community governance structures, not quasi-governmental, but something that that puts governance down at the community level and that will really begin to revitalise uh
[00:47:37] Randall Roth: Well that that resonates with me. I I like the idea of of decentralization. I like the idea of putting the decision making as close to the people who are going to be directly affected by those decisions as possible.
[00:47:48] Peter Adler: And the trick is to do it without creating huge new bureaucracies.
[00:47:51] Randall Roth: Oh boy, there you go. Well Randy, congratulations on behalf of all of us. I've just uh we're all proud to be uh listeners and participants and Godspeed. Okey-doke. Thank you, sir. Bye-bye. We go to another Peter, this one from Hawaii Kai. Good morning, Peter.
[00:48:06] Peter: Good morning. I really enjoy your show. Um of the times that I have listened to it. I have a question. Um how many times has a real given issue for another island have you had on your show? I mean have you um, you know, used as a basis for a for a show in the last 5 years?
[00:48:25] Randall Roth: Not many times, Peter. And Suzie and I have have really gone back and forth on this one. Um we've tried to to make it a statewide sort of focus, but at the same time, when you look at something that is happening on Molokai or happening on the big island or what have you, the people that we've talked to here on Oahu have led us to believe that that we're just not going to have the kind of of interest from our usual audience that we we strive for. And so we have done it a few times Peter, but if uh if your question is is a little bit of a comment, uh bit of a critique on how we've done it, then I think that's a fair one.
[00:49:07] Peter: Yeah, you are. I lived on Maui for what 4 years and now that I'm out I'm over here. Um I can't other than a few articles in the newspaper um it's really hard to find out what's going on over there, unless you go and find Yeah. you know the Maui news, let's say, for the next day. You know, nobody really knows that they're burning cane over there. You're You're absolutely You're absolutely right, and uh there's a lot of pollution that takes place over there. Yeah. So uh you know and and how is anybody really going to know unless unless you go over there.
[00:49:39] Randall Roth: Let let me just say that that we get a lot of people or have had a lot of people over the years call and and say, why aren't you doing this? Why aren't you doing that? etc. And and my response has always been and and I know this is not going to be terribly satisfying but my response has always been you know, one show can't do everything. And we've tried to have a a consistent focused um vision if you will in terms of of what we're trying to do. And we've tried to speak through our actions uh more so than telling people exactly what it is that we're trying to do. And I've always encouraged people to do what we did. Just try to find a forum and try to do something that is going to uh further a vision of yours. There is opportunity out there, unfortunately, it it's very time-consuming. It's far more time-consuming to do something like this than people realize. It's far more consuming to or time consuming to get the opportunity to do it than people would normally realize and, and that's a problem. But if you can put that kind of effort into it, I'm convinced that you could have a show whether it's a radio show or something else, whether it's on public radio or some other radio station, I'm convinced that there is that possibility but somebody has to decide somebody with fire in their belly has to decide that they're going to make it happen but if if you decide it's going to happen and you put the time into it, it will.
[00:51:06] Randall Roth: Okay, thank you very much. Thank you, appreciate your call. Let's see. Dana on the Big Island I think is next. Good morning, Dana.
[00:51:13] Dana: Yeah, thank you for taking my call. We just have to say we're going to really miss your program. It's really been inspiring to to hear the challenging thoughts and to allow a forum of people to speak. And uh I suppose we in weighing the cost we wonder if your endorsement was worth the price to lose the show but thank you for giving us a voice and I encourage you to continue to provide voices for people that sometimes do not have a voice, so thank you, Randy.
[00:51:46] Randall Roth: Thank you, Dana. Appreciate your call.
[00:51:49] Randall Roth: We talk about the price of paradise, you know that came from an old quote that the price of freedom is eternal vigilance and we like to suggest with our name that the price of paradise, the price of preserving what makes all of this want to make this our home, the price of that is is eternal vigilance, and everyone has to define vigilance in their own way. For us it's been trying to increase the level of activity in the marketplace of ideas, trying to stimulate lively and informed dialogue. But as I mentioned earlier, each person I think progresses at their own pace and for Suzie and for me, we we kind of feel like it's time for us to to take a step and and uh I'm sure others will will fill the void if there is a void. Let's go to Lola from Kahalu'u. Good morning, Lola.
[00:52:38] Lola: Aloha Randy, I want to tell you I really appreciated your program, and I will miss it tremendously. Now my concern, and I've been vocally concerned for many years about Hawaii's environmental climate and I don't see that Linda Lingle has a good environmental record as, and I can't offer you another name that has a better, but it what it seems is that the people are very concerned about the environment but the politicians well, sort of sell out.
[00:53:12] Randall Roth: Yeah, you know Lola, where I am on this is that I think the what what you call the people. I think we can have our conversations, and we can try to to make our voices heard but unless we get involved in campaigns unless we find a candidate and and try to influence their thinking, try to to get them to hear us and to appreciate what we're saying, why we're saying it, then I think we're just saying it to each other. And so, whether it's the campaign that I've chosen or a different campaign, a different candidate, I would encourage you to to get involved, and with the one that is closest to what you're looking for and then just see if you can have that that influence that uh that supporters sometimes can have to to open a candidate's ears and hearts and minds etc to uh to an issue that maybe they just haven't been as sensitive to as they should have been.
[00:54:04] Lola: Well, it comes down, I've done that for years and years. I've been very involved and I know what you're saying when you say it takes a tremendous amount of time and energy. But uh what it comes down to is the money required to run a a campaign obligates the politicians.
[00:54:26] Randall Roth: Well, you're right. This is all much more complicated than just our rolling up our sleeves trying hard and never giving up, and I I appreciate that, Lola and I I think if we as a community just keep trying hard we're we're going to make uh, you know, a couple steps forward, even though there's going to be a step back once in a while and um, it's it's direction that's important and we just have to keep trying.
[00:54:50] Lola: Well I hope you can influence Linda on her on her environmental outlook. Thank you Lola. Appreciate your call.
[00:54:57] Randall Roth: You know, we've got a few more people have been waiting patiently, and I'm going to try to get to all of them, but our show's producer that most of you have never heard before, Suzy, my wife is in the studio now. And uh, I just thought I would give her an opportunity to say hello to all of our listeners. She's the one who often times will answer the phone, although our our boys help her with that. Suzy, quick thoughts on what we're doing or how the show is going or anything else before we get to some of our callers?
[00:55:27] Susie Roth: Well, real quickly, I just want to say I've my biggest worry was having to cut someone off as the screener when people call in, and we've been very fortunate to have a a great listening audience, and we've never had to do that.
[00:55:39] Randall Roth: Yeah, we uh people sometimes are surprised when we tell them we don't have a button that we can push that can that can uh stop the audience from hearing something inappropriate that a caller has said. Um but uh everyone else has that, ours ours is broken. My technician is giving me a panic look. At any rate, uh we have tried real hard to let absolutely everybody speak. I guess there was the one caller Suzy that uh kept calling week after week with the same issue, and you suggested that maybe they shouldn't call every week and they called you called you a Nazi or something like that. So there's been a downside to this job. Here's what we're going to try to do folks, our lines have been filling up just as soon as as they're empty and I know there are a lot of people who feel strongly um against the decision that that we've made, they're for a different candidate, or a lot of people have different things to share, and what I'm going to ask, as I go through the people who've been waiting patiently, if you could make your comment as as quickly as possible so that we can hear everyone who's been waiting, uh let's go first to Joe in Makakilo. Good morning Joe.
[00:56:45] Joe: Hello Randy. Thank you Randy. Thank you Suzy. The only solace I have is that I have a lot of your programs on tape. Uh it took courage to do what you're doing. We need a two-party system. Uh most of all though Randy, thank you for for doing a program where you all
[00:57:00] Randall Roth: took the high road. You were always tolerant. And in a lot of cases things weren't necessarily easy to deal with that. Thanks for that, Randy. We'll miss you.
[00:57:08] Joe: Thank you, Joe.
[00:57:09] Randall Roth: We go to Daniel from Maui, and Daniel, if you can keep it real tight so everybody else has a chance to say something, I'd appreciate it.
[00:57:16] Daniel: Hey, Randy, I I really appreciate your show. Thanks so much for doing it, and I agree with one of your callers that Kaiytano is no prize. But I'd also like to point out that you guys are not really familiar with, well, you know, the way we are here on Maui, and which four years ago she ran on, um, changing a lot of things. And in in that time, she hasn't, and I'd just like to point out real quick for you as a lawyer, um, before you jump full hog into her um, wagon, I think you should look at her use of the corporation Council in Council meeting, and I'm referring especially to JP Schmidt.
[00:57:54] Daniel: And I know my wife would like to say something, but if you're that short of time, um, is can she say something?
[00:57:59] Randall Roth: Uh, it's going to have to be real short, Daniel, because we got three more people that we need to get to.
[00:58:04] Lucienne: Hi, Randy. Lucienne here. Well, I read what Daniel says. It's like things are not what they appear on the surface. Business is very entangled by regulations here. We really hoped that Linda would be because she's a very talented person able to carry through the kinds of things that she promised. But, um, my my theory is is that, uh, no matter how hard you work with a candidate, you've got to get somebody that really has backbone, and there are very few people in the arena that do. I wish one of them were running for governor right now, but, uh, I I applaud your enthusiasm.
[00:58:38] Lucienne: But just urge you to look deeper and and talk to people here on Maui who, you know, weighed the situation and and lives through the myth. We have we have a a very questionable economy here too, it's just that it's covered up. Lots of things are covered up, and that's the that's the thing that I think people don't realize. Linda's a great speaker and she's a very imaginative person, very charismatic and very very bright and able administrator, but she has some she's covered up a lot of things here that um, people have just been cut off from, you know, being very arrogant.
[00:59:11] Randall Roth: Luci, I don't want to sound like I'm cutting you off because people might get the, Okay, well thank you for your chance to comment. People might get the impression it's because I disagree with you. Um, but, uh, we do have to move on. Thank you very much.
[00:59:21] Lucienne: Aloha.
[00:59:22] Randall Roth: Um, people, stop calling. As soon as a line goes uh blank, it uh starts lighting up again. We've got just a couple of minutes real quickly. Next is James Wood from the Big Island. James, good morning. Well, we just lost him. We'll go to Larry from Manoa.
[00:59:37] Larry: Randy, first, gushing thanks and appreciation for all you've done all these years. I've always been one of your greatest fans.
[00:59:44] Randall Roth: Thank you.
[00:59:44] Larry: And I I know you need to do what you need to do now. Um, and also it's been on my mind, you know, last year when um, when you thought you were going to drop the program. Perhaps we could somehow, those of us in the community who think this is valuable, perhaps we can come up with a way to maybe not get the same thing, but maybe have a continue a forum in some way.
[01:00:05] Larry: And so, I invite your listeners to kind of descend on the radio station or send their names in or somehow, let's get together and see so we so that uh how how we might continue what's been really really good that you've been doing.
[01:00:19] Randall Roth: Okay. I appreciate that, Larry, and I would simply echo that, folks. If if you like this sort of public dialogue, it's only going to happen if you get together, figure out how to make it happen. Thank you, Larry.
[01:00:31] Larry: Bye.
[01:00:32] Randall Roth: We go to, I think it's Dr. Morris from Honolulu. Good morning, Dr. Morris.
[01:00:37] Dr. Morris: I am no doctor, Randy, but I really appreciate the the goodwill you've brought to your program, and I'm glad to see that you and I are thinking alike in terms of the way things must change. Thought, presuming we're successful, how do you feel about becoming the attorney general?
[01:00:52] Randall Roth: Well, I personally think that we need an elected attorney general. I personally am encouraging Mayor Lingle to uh consider pushing that. Um, we're only one of six states that still has an appointed attorney general. It seems clear to me that uh as a general statement at least our attorney generals in the past have functioned primarily as a lawyer for the governor as opposed to a lawyer for the people.
[01:01:18] Randall Roth: So, that's frankly number one on my agenda. Number two, uh, I'm confident that uh Mayor Lingle is going to make appointments based upon the merits, and I'm not uh at all sure that uh that I would be on the A-list. I certainly have a list of folks that I think would be excellent and uh and I haven't put myself on it. So, I appreciate your call.
[01:01:40] Randall Roth: Um, we're just about out of time though. Uh, the folks, thank you. The the folks who who called in and we're not going to be able to get to uh, um, stay on the line if you'd like and I'll be happy to chat with you in two minutes when we're off the air.
[01:01:55] Randall Roth: Just real quickly, the Hawaii Community Foundation has been our sponsor for a long, long time. There are a lot of real good people over there. Anyone who would like to do something very positive for this community, would like to do something that is going to increase the quality of life in Hawaii, if especially if they like grass root efforts, I would encourage you to call the people at the Hawaii Community Foundation, find out what they're all about, and and help them out. I want to thank Hawaii Public Radio for working with us over these years. Uh, we've really appreciated being a part of their outstanding organization.
[01:02:31] Randall Roth: Jeff Alardi has contributed so much to this show. Uh, it simply would not have happened without Jeff. Uh, our producer Susie Roth over here, uh, Tom and John Roth out there on the phone right now, and of course the listeners, without the listeners, uh, we are absolutely nothing. Susie, you've got the last uh, 10 seconds.
[01:02:51] Susie Roth: Well, I'd like to just say thanks again, and this is and was the Price of Paradise radio show.
[01:02:59] Randall Roth: There you go folks. You've been listening for five years, at least some of you to pop radio. My name is Randy Roth, on behalf of everybody who's worked on this show. Aloha.