Assessing the 1996 Legislative Session
Price of Paradise · Hawaii Public Radio · aired 1996-05-05
Guests: Calvin Say (State Representative; Chair, House Finance Committee); Joe Souki (Speaker, Hawaii House of Representatives); Milton Holt (State Senator); Michael Liu (State Representative); Terry Tom (State Representative); Cynthia Thielen (State Representative)
Duration: 01:04:54

[00:00:03] Randall Roth: Good morning. This is Randy Roth, host of the Price of Paradise Radio Show. We're live each Sunday morning at 8:00 on KHPR 88.1 FM and KKUA 90.7 FM, and then replayed Sunday evenings at 8:00 on KIFO 1380 AM. Everyone who works to bring this show to you is a volunteer who believes in the importance of lively and informed dialogue. Our sponsor is the Hawaii Community Foundation, an organization that encourages grassroot efforts to improve the quality of life in Hawaii and that manages charitable funds with efficiency and compassion. Well, our topic this morning is the 1996 legislative session. According to the Star bulletin, it was a dud. According to the advertiser, it was a fiasco. An editorial in the Star bulletin said all talk and no action, so certainly there's been a lot of criticism about the session.

[00:00:55] Randall Roth: But not everybody believes that it was a flop, and if you've seen your morning newspaper, the focus section of the advertiser, you see on page B3, the headline was the legislature of flop. Two of the articles say yes and go on to explain why. Two of the articles say no and go on to explain why. Well, in just a moment, I'm going to introduce our our four guests, but first I want to emphasize that this morning we'd like to keep the conversation focused on on how the issues were handled rather than the issues themselves. Obviously things like car insurance, same sex marriage, high three pension reform, etc., could be the topic of many many radio programs in and of themselves. And so if possible, we want to focus on how it was that the legislature dealt or didn't do deal with the issues as opposed to the issues themselves.

[00:01:46] Randall Roth: Uh, secondly, we have a goal this morning of hearing as many different voices as we possibly can, and so I'm going to ask my guests in the studio and and also the callers to try to keep your comments as as short as possible so that we can achieve that goal of hearing lots of different voices. With me in the studio, I have Terence Tom, who is the chair of the House Judiciary Committee and as such was involved in in many, many conversations having to do with a number of bills and the one that the the media picked up on the most I suppose Terry, was same-sex marriage. We also have Milton Holt, who is chair of the Senate judiciary or no the Senate Consumer Protection Committee, and as such, again, many, many bills came through his committee, but one in particular that the media picked up on a lot was the attempt to reform car insurance in Hawaii.

[00:02:38] Randall Roth: And also in the studio, we have Cynthia Theelen, who is a Republican and I guess as such kind of a rare bird in the legislature, but a member of the House of Representatives. Good morning, Cynthia. Good morning, Milton and Terry.

[00:02:48] Cynthia Thielen: Good morning. Randy, I should mention our flock is growing.

[00:02:53] Randall Roth: Your flock is growing, okay. Uh by phone, we have Joe Souki. Uh Joe is uh at home on Maui right now. He's the speaker of the house. Joe, can you hear me? Joe, can you hear me? Well, I think we we got Joe. Our Jeff Ilti, our director of Operations is going to be making sure that that line is complete here in a minute. Joe, are you there?

[00:03:14] Joe Souki: I am here.

[00:03:15] Randall Roth: All right, well we're going to be coming to you in in just a minute. All right. Um, Terry, I know you realize that there's been a lot of criticism of the legislative session. Uh, the advertiser and the Star bulletin, in particular, have used some, some words that uh you would probably say are, are unkind words, right? Dud, fiasco, that sort of thing.

[00:03:37] Terry Tom: I never read the paper.

[00:03:39] Randall Roth: They're not it's not in Braille yet, it's not in Braille yet. Okay. Well, I know from your article in this morning's paper, that you have a different uh attitude about the work of the legislature this year. Could you tell us about it?

[00:03:51] Terry Tom: Well, first of all, I think a lot of times, um uh people uh tend to look at a session and they um they focus on one or two issues and that's about it. They they don't the you know, rightful wrongfully so they they look at several issues and I think that you've got to look at every session as a whole. You've got to look at all of the things that we did and the members work very hard. Um, you've got to be down there to really understand and realize how hard many of the members do work. We put in 20 hour days, and and so there were a lot of very good issues that were resolved this year. Our streets were going to be a lot safer. I can go into it and if you want, but we've we've done a lot of tough issues on ice and on education, on probate, and as and as you know, Randy, a lot of the times that we handle things, it's because of people who give their input in in making good legislation.

[00:04:47] Terry Tom: And and you certainly are one of them and I want to take this opportunity to personally thank you and in assisting us in this 300 page probate code, which is going to make it a lot easier for people to get their estates in order and for loved ones to handle the estates of decedents. Um the other thing I if I um wanted to just point out, is in this issue on marriage. And as you know, this issue is a very controversial issue. And many of the critics say that we just spent too much time of it on this issue. And I just want to get this off my chest. I want to respectfully disagree with the critics because you got a lot of issues in Hawaii that are going to come and go.

[00:05:28] Terry Tom: I mean our budget, um next year, we'll be working on another budget. No fault, we issues that our state related, um people are concerned about. I think the same-sex marriage issue, however, is one issue that's not going away until we bring some finality to it. And the most critical part about it is that the entire world is watching Hawaii on this issue. It's not just a state issue. It's an international issue where Hawaii could ultimately be the first state in the country, and really the first state in the world to have same-sex marriages. So everyone's very concerned and it has an entirely international impact on it. So I think this issue had to be spent on in the legislature. I'm sorry that we didn't not resolve it, but certainly this issue, unlike other issues, receive are going to receive international and continue to receive international attention until we are able to resolve it.

[00:06:29] Randall Roth: Okay, and I and I guess I'm looking at your article in this morning's paper, one line that jumps out at me as you say, I would rather have no bill than a compromise that creates a bad bill that hurts Hawaii.

[00:06:39] Terry Tom: Well, that's not only for marriage, that's a lot of bills. There are a lot, there are several issues that, you know, it's just we've spent several hundred of years with a tort law, you know, with with within the England and the United States. What's the matter? You don't want to change that overnight? We you know, we it's difficult. When you have issues of this nature, compromise is good if we can compromise on something that everyone can agree on and live with and work with. When compromise is not possible and we compromise just for the sake of compromising and coming up with something that is not going to be good for the people of this state, it's better not to compromise and that's how I feel.

[00:07:23] Randall Roth: Okay. All right, well, there you have it. Cynthia Theelen, you're on the other side of the aisle as they say and I suppose one might expect you to be critical in any event, but you're not alone this year. There are a lot of folks who are are concerned. Tell us what you're thinking.

[00:07:36] Cynthia Thielen: I think that the House Republicans really are representing the frustration of the citizens in Hawaii. Uh we've heard many, many calls calling us to say, look at, we're with you, what can we do, what can we do? Uh the House Republicans graded the legislative session. Yes, it was a dud. Yes, it was a fiasco. And we graded the legislative session as follows, and if anyone wants to tune in and see this visually, they could probably see it tonight on channel two. The uh House Republicans' um legislative report card. I I see a lot of F's and D's. Are the F's fiasco and D's are duds, is that how you do it? I think that's a good way to say it. F's for fiasco, no fault reform, no fault insurance reform.

[00:08:19] Cynthia Thielen: House Republicans had a bill that we didn't care if it would if it had been adopted by the Democrats and slid into one of their bills. We just wanted to get it through. It would have resulted in Hawaii's motorists getting about $315 or $17 back uh out of their automobile insurance premium payment. This would assume that they were paying $1,100 a year per vehicle. There were a number of measures that didn't make it through. I don't think it's compromise that's the issue. I think it's a lack of leadership. We should have reformed the high three. We didn't, and the high three for the listeners that don't know is the way that legislators get to retire, get a high paying state job for three years and then their retirement benefits are based upon that higher amount.

[00:09:05] Cynthia Thielen: So it really takes money out of the general fund that could be used for programs such as helping the disabled on general assistance. Instead they were dropped down to $217 a month.

[00:09:18] Randall Roth: So again, I guess not focusing so much on the issue, but how the issues were were handled, you and and your colleague, Michael Leu, in this morning's newspaper, I think are saying, there were some major issues that needed to be addressed and the major issues didn't get addressed.

[00:09:31] Cynthia Thielen: Exactly, and it was a lack of leadership and I don't think that that responsibility belongs with Richard Port, thank you. Richard Port is not serving in the legislature. It belongs with those people sitting in the legislature and there was a lack of leadership and we did not pull through for the public.

[00:09:48] Randall Roth: Until the last few seconds, I thought Milton, you were going to have to agree with everything that that Cynthia was saying. At least reading your article in the newspaper, I know you too felt that there was some unfunny unfinished business, that there were some issues that that needed to be addressed and and you would like to have the legislature come back and address them. But I know there are a couple of things that Cynthia said, uh that you don't agree with. Summarize for us your thoughts on on the '96 legislative session.

[00:10:12] Milton Holt: Well, I'm not here to debate Cynthia. I'm here merely to respond to some of the issues that you raised uh how the issues were dealt with during the session. Um, as far as auto reform, which was an important issue, and still is an important issue, um we were very close and uh I would have hoped that we we might have uh had sufficient time to strike a deal. Even now, I have some thoughts about um looking even uh further at the house position. And uh, if Representative Souki, Chairman, Speaker Souki's out there, I make an offer right now. Let's go back to the table. I can buy some of the positions you got in the house and we might have a bill.

[00:10:57] Randall Roth: Okay, well we'll ask him uh if he's willing to do that in in just a moment. But but I guess you're saying if there is a special session, you think something will happen on car insurance.

[00:11:06] Milton Holt: Yeah. All I'm saying is that I've been in the legislature for a number of years, and when we've had situations where major issues haven't been decided yet, um the leaders in the in the the legislature um who are responsible for for representing the people, um made it a point to keep us there till we dealt with the people's issues.

[00:11:32] Randall Roth: Okay. And from your article, I know also, you've been generally critical of of leadership in the legislature and leadership in the Democratic Party. Um, Richard Port has been probably as critical of this legislative session as has the chair of the Republican Party, and it's created the uh uh kind of [unintelligible — audio glitch] controversy within a controversy and and I think you're part of that.

[00:11:57] Milton Holt: Well, I think I can understand the leadership of the Republican Party because they're a minority and they're not running the show in the legislature. Uh, however, the Democrats do have control of both houses. But when the party uh gets involved with individual issues and takes position on individual issues, which affect which which Democrats may differ on, it affects uh the system. And I think that that's not the proper place for the party to get involved.

[00:12:22] Randall Roth: Okay, so you feel that the Richard Port as chair of the party has has inserted himself at times and in ways that have been what, counterproductive from your standpoint?

[00:12:31] Milton Holt: Well, yeah, the party is supposed to be uh supportive of some broad, you know, issues, uh education, health, welfare, but not get into specifics on whether it should be pure no fault, right, or pure tort. Okay. I mean, as far as auto reform, yeah, I can I can understand the party supporting something like that. But taking a position specifically, I think that's not appropriate.

[00:12:55] Randall Roth: Okay. Joe Souki, you're still there?

[00:12:57] Joe Souki: Yes, Randy, I'm here.

[00:12:58] Randall Roth: Well, I know you've heard all of that and I bet you've got a few thoughts to share about the session or about anything uh that you've heard your colleagues talk about.

[00:13:06] Joe Souki: Certainly. I again, I want to uh impress to the public and of course to you, Randy, that I thought we had a very good session. We passed a lot of good legislation, and within the time uh uh frame that we had, uh uh we uh did uh very well. You must understand that uh you work in with 76 individuals and most of them are very intelligent and a very strong will. And uh, take it in a home when you're in a house and you look family and you try to come to agreement, sometimes you have some uh some some difficulty in coming to agreements. Now, when you you magnify it, uh, uh, 76 fold, and plus the pressures from the media and the pressures from the community and the from the special interest groups and from all over then you can see some uh some difficulties with moving along, especially in the the so called major issues, which seem to be the total focus of the of the media.

[00:14:14] Joe Souki: Mhm. In fact, I just like to say that one of the media is getting to be like a tabloid, you know, they uh they seem to sensationalize uh uh those things that they are very interested in and forget about all the wrath that are of great concern and and used to the to the people of the state of Hawaii.

[00:14:35] Randall Roth: Mhm. So I guess along the lines of of Terry Tom's comment in his article this morning that it in the quote is forgotten by the headlines are the other 350 bills that did get passed.

[00:14:46] Joe Souki: That is correct, Randy. That is correct. And uh you also understand that in the past years we've also coming to some very difficult issues where we had to uh uh had to adjourn and rest a little bit and come back again and we look at it. And uh the year is not over yet, we can go back again and we can work on the issues uh if it's uh like the, I'm glad to hear that that uh Senator Holt said that we're close and that he can look at some of the issues of no look at uh auto insurance. And uh I'm uh I'm I'm looking at that in a very positive way, and I believe I sincerely believe that that we can resolve this problem.

[00:15:28] Randall Roth: Okay. Great. Well folks, there you have it. The the four guests that we have, three in the studio and Joe Souki by phone have shared their thoughts very briefly with you about the legislative session. One of our goals is to hear as many different voices as possible. So as we go to the callers, we're going to ask you to keep it uh as short as you possibly can. Anyone who would like to call in, the number is 955-8821. If you're on a neighbor island, the number is 1-800-955-8821. Again, to ask a question or make a brief comment, we have in the studio Cynthia Theelen, Milton Holt, Terry Tom and by phone Joe Souki. Let's start with Don and Melilani. Good morning, Don.

[00:16:09] Caller: Good morning. Thank you for taking my call.

[00:16:11] Randall Roth: You bet.

[00:16:12] Caller: I have a question about uh, this is not about the issue but how it was handled. The April 4th hearing of Senator Holt's committee on consumer protection was posted as a hearing on licensure of healthcare providers. My question is, why then did Jack Hogue of Hawaii's future today come prepared with written testimony opposing same-gender marriage? Was he advised previously of the true intent of the hearing? Thank you.

[00:16:36] Randall Roth: Okay. And and Milton, so that all of our listeners know at least generally what this is all about. My understanding just from reading the newspapers is that that you pulled a a little bit of an end run and I don't know if that's the right metaphor or not, but generally things come through a specific committee and same-sex marriage was supposed to to originate in the judiciary committee. And as I understand it, you did something that was viewed as as unconventional. Some people liked it, some people didn't. But you started in your Consumer Protection Committee something that would deal with same-sex marriage and um have been criticized by some and praised by others. What do you say?

[00:17:14] Milton Holt: Well, what we had uh, posted a notice on was a licensing bill. The title of the bill was relating to licensing. The contents of the bill that ends that was proposed in the draft was a purpose clause relating to the licensing of marriages. Now, it did not speak to same-sex marriages, it spoke to the marriage licensing. Um, in that respect, I felt that I had part jurisdiction over the bill, although the body disagreed. Uh, that was a process that we went forth as far as the question that was posed. Uh, the reason it was posed uh, posted and that notice was not given to the last minute, was that we had waited until at least noon that day, which was would have been the last time that the Senate judiciary committee could have waived the 72 hour notice to hear the house bill on the on the constitutional amendment and when that deadline passed, is when we notified people that we were going to go ahead and try to put that into a licensing bill.

[00:18:09] Milton Holt: It was not pre-arranged at any time. We were just hoping that something might have broke in the Senate.

[00:18:14] Randall Roth: Can a hail Mary pass, is that a better one? Well, it was and I kid you. Cynthia is playing football. Yeah I was I will play football, but that was something that we felt that at least would would have brought the issue forward for for further discussion. Okay, Don and Mielani, thank you for your call. And as I said, we're going to try to move through these through these real quickly. Cynthia has a brief comment.

[00:18:34] Cynthia Thielen: I do have a very brief comment to Don. I brought the football as symbolic of some of the end runs that occur in the legislature. Um, it's I don't agree with the that process. It has happened before. This isn't the first time. This isn't the only bill on which it happened. But I don't think that that should occur. It really it prohibits the the public who is involved in that issue from having the opportunity to come in and testify.

[00:19:00] Milton Holt: Yeah, I I just wanted to make a very brief comment that I'm not here to comment on what what uh Senator Holt did was proper or not proper, but I I want to state that time had run out and I'm I'm glad the result came that we could continue to discuss this issue. Senator Holt gave us the opportunity, both houses to continue discussion on this issue. It was a very important issue and um I'm glad that he provided that opportunity for us to do so, okay? We would have been dead. We go to Mark in Manoah. Good morning, Mark.

[00:19:33] Caller: Good morning. How y'all doing? I'm fine. What do you have for us? Well, I just had a question for Senator Holt. I just I know that Senator Holt said that he was really interested in no fault insurance reform this session and then pretty much controlled this issue. So if this was true, then how come he introduced a bill that on no fault that was similar to the one that Cayetano vetoed last year? And also, why does he think that all the insurance companies are reporting record profits in 1995?

[00:20:01] Milton Holt: Uh, in response to your question, we didn't introduce a bill similar to the one that was vetoed by the governor last year. We address the questions of the roll back. We address the constitutionality of the bill. Um, in fact, the bill that we ended up with doesn't even look like the bill that was vetoed by the governor last year. We we taken the time over the interim to uh look at the issues that he raised in his veto message and we felt that they were satisfactorily dealt with. Okay. Mark, thank you for your call.

[00:20:33] Caller: How come all the insurance companies reported record profits in 1995?

[00:20:36] Milton Holt: I've got to move on and I recognize the next name on our list of callers is somebody who's going to raise the exact same topic and he's on your side of the issue. Shell and Mo E Good morning, Shell.

[00:20:46] Caller: Good morning, Randy. Can you make it quick? I can make it quick. Uh, the statement that Senator Holt just made about the the House and the Senate, we're getting very close. I think it's disingenuous at best. Anyone that followed this issue knows that they were miles apart. Uh, the Senator will tell us that uh he made many, many concessions, but they were still at offices ends of the poll. And uh, I just, I feel like that uh these statements are just uh trying to save his political, and I'll leave it at that.

[00:21:18] Randall Roth: Shell, thanks for your call.

[00:21:19] Cynthia Thielen: Um, Randy, if I can make just a short comment, the the house had a very good version, um, and it would have saved the motorist about the 22 to 35% in their premiums. Um, I'm concerned about this whole process of calling for a special session, because I believe that we are paid to do our work in 60 days, and there's no reason we couldn't have done our work within that period of time. I think a special session may have political reasons for being called and I don't agree with it.

[00:21:49] Milton Holt: Just in response to that, if if we went along with that philosophy, uh every session, we would not have a convention center be built right now. That was done during a special session.

[00:22:00] Cynthia Thielen: My question is, why can't the legislature?

[00:22:02] Joe Souki: I wouldn't agree with that, Cynthia. I think it's been very very opportunistic in bringing this this subject up, you know, for a while. I mean, as a long time legislator, you know, that sometimes in the heated area of the session, we need to sit back and sit back a little bit and re-consider the subject and go back to it.

[00:22:24] Cynthia Thielen: Then Joe, I propose that we add Hi Three to the list of those things to be on the table.

[00:22:29] Joe Souki: Well, that will make it to the I three reforms again. That is very, very, uh opportunistic. You mentioned that high three comes from the general fund. You know, well, it doesn't come. It comes from the retirement system. But the general fund and I wish you would I wish you would stick to the facts and rather than try and put some ill-conceived ideas to the public.

[00:22:49] Cynthia Thielen: Joe we Joe we also one quick one quick response to Joe.

[00:22:54] Joe Souki: You're trying to you're trying to monopolize. Why don't you let somebody else speak?

[00:23:00] Randall Roth: Okay, with that I blow the whistle and we go to Martha in New Valley. Good morning, Martha.

[00:23:05] Caller: Good morning. Thank you for having this form. I appreciate this. Um, I'm a member of a grassroots community who for the past three years have brought an issue before the legislature. We've been supported by the Psychiatric Association, psychological community, as well as the Department of Health and Human Services. And for three years running, the House has not heard our bills. The issue has not had a hearing.

[00:23:32] Randall Roth: Which which committee have you tried to get it out of?

[00:23:34] Caller: This bill was passed to Terry Tom and the judiciary committee.

[00:23:40] Randall Roth: Okay, let let me turn this over to Terry and Terry. If you need to ask her some questions, to get more details. But tell us a little bit about why something would would not get past the committee for years and years.

[00:23:51] Milton Holt: Well, first of all, um I just want to say that the judiciary uh committee covers a whole range of issues. We deal with the courts, we deal with the we deal with uh the judicial issues, we deal with civil issues, we deal with uh anything that anything and everything that's philosophical, that's that's controversial. It normally goes to the judiciary committee and we cannot say uh we don't have the money to fund it. Uh you're you know, we're caught between a rock and a hard part because you're going to have half the people agree with what we're doing and half the people uh many times disagree. We deal with like capital punishment, we deal with the marriage issue, we deal with guns, we deal with everything that's seemingly controversial. I have to make the cause on what to hear and what not to hear because we just don't have the time. We have 60 days, we have three week schedules in which we have to hear, consider 5 to 600 bills uh at one time. It's very impossible to do, so we try our very best to hear as many bills as we can to place the kind of priority that we can, and I use as my guideline, what will what laws that we pass will help to improve the quality of life for people. Controversial or not, what can we do? And I've always tried to use that as my yard stick in determining what bills to hear, but certainly we cannot hear everyone.

[00:25:21] Cynthia Thielen: If you don't agree with uh representative, then then it simply doesn't get heard. We we have known that you haven't agreed with this issue, but and yet there's an enormous amount of community support

[00:25:33] Milton Holt: I don't know what issue we're talking about.

[00:25:35] Randall Roth: Martha, and and we we simply can't get into any specific issue because [unintelligible — audio glitch] we have to stick with with our theme that we started with, but, but let me ask my own version of of one part I think of what you're asking, and that is, why is it that it seems as though one person, the chair of a committee, can pretty much control whether a bill is going to to get considered by by other members of the legislature?

[00:25:59] Milton Holt: Okay, that that first of all, let me restate my position on that. Yes, the bills are referred to each committee by subject matter. And yes, we do I do look at each and every bill that comes to me. I speak to other members of the legislature for their input on certain bills on many of the bills that they're interested in, and I also speak to a lot of the people who call our offices. I call them personally in the general public to find out what the ramifications are on the bill, on each bill. I try to do my homework. I don't just look at a piece of legislation and say, I don't like it and so I won't hear it. There are many times that I have not agreed on certain types of controversial bills uh that come to the committee, but I have heard it, and I have done that because I feel that bills deserve a hearing. Terry. So we try to do as best we can.

[00:26:55] Joe Souki: In the House of Representatives, the uh House House leadership takes a very active part in as far as what bills will be heard and what bills are not be heard. And uh the uh Terrence Tom is a very considerate. He always touches base with with me, calls me, comes in, and and sees me and and asks me what you think about this bill. So it's it's a team effort. I think uh together with Terry, the finance chairman and members of the other committees in the house leadership, we jointly agree uh what bills is going to be heard and not and not heard. So it it's not that that the chair at least in a house that I can speak for the house, uh is the one who who will ultimately stifle a bill. It's it's a it's a joint understanding if it comes to that at all.

[00:28:21] Randall Roth: You'll be able to do just that. Also, you might tune in to KHON Channel Two news tonight at six and 10. We think probably there'll be a report on pop radio then. Beth Hillier is here along with Ted the cameraman. Again, our number is 955-8821. Let's go to Martha in let's see. We just finished with Martha. Let's go to Diana in Haula. Good morning, Diana.

[00:28:46] Caller: Yes, um I have a statement to make.

[00:28:51] Randall Roth: Martha, can you speak up just a little bit?

[00:28:52] Caller: Yeah, I have a statement to make. I feel like Richard Port is the only person who's brought credibility to the Democratic Party and the legislators should be ashamed of themselves. Um, they waste time on things like single sex marriage, they reduce money to the disabled, and personally our auto insurance was up 300%. It's the real bread and butter issues that are the ones that people really care about. And these other things are just to distract us and not do anything that really means that they have to take on the big power groups and and look after ordinary people and I'm glad Richard Port spoke out because the Democratic Party doesn't seem to be standing for us anymore.

[00:29:33] Randall Roth: Diana, thank you very much for your call. I'm going to let Terry Tom respond to that briefly and then we need to move on. Go ahead, Terry.

[00:29:38] Terry Tom: Yeah.

[00:36:34] Randall Roth: Yeah, real fast. I just want to say too that I remember several years ago when uh Speaker Suki was in house finance term and there was a big issue on the whole Kakaka development project, and Milton was on the other side and I was a real new Turk then and I was scared because they said Milton was sitting on the other side and I didn't know what to do. I couldn't sleep at night, had nightmares. He was the easiest person to work with. He really was. I worked with Milton on the issue. Fortunately, I had um uh representative Sey, who is now Finance Chair assist me, but I think I learned a lot about the legislative process, and I learned a lot at that point from Milton. And then we got a bill in that took all year to uh resolve, but we when I took over and I worked with Milton, uh we we worked it out in a day and a half and look at the Kakaka development now, the park. And so I I you know

[00:37:25] Randall Roth: I've got each of my guests has more to say and I've got the lines packed. I'm going to I'm going to move through these these callers real quickly and I apologize to the people in the studio. I know you each have something else to say on that, but let's go to Joseph in Makiki. Good morning, Joseph.

[00:37:38] Caller: Good morning. Uh I have a general question. Anyone can answer. Why in residents pay the second highest auto insurance premiums in the nation? Many of the members of the committees which act upon bills attempting to get reform are directly connected to the insurance industry. What can be done to prevent

[00:38:00] Randall Roth: They are blocking bills which are opposed by insurance companies and would give consumers relief. I tell you what Joseph, I'm going to take that as a comment, okay? Because I think I think your question made the point you wanted to make, and we'll go to Jim in Punchbowl area. Good morning Jim.

[00:38:14] Caller: Jim are you there? Yes I'm here.

[00:38:16] Randall Roth: Uh can you give us a question or comment as quickly as possible. One of our goals this morning is to try to hear a lot of different voices.

[00:38:22] Caller: Sure. My name is Jim Brewer and this is mainly directed at Speaker Suki and my question is, would a special session address the problem of the people on general assistance, who on July the first are probably going to become homeless because the general assistance payments were cut in half which means that people can't pay their rent. I think there are about 10,000 people on general assistance.

[00:38:52] Randall Roth: Jim let's let's ask Joe. What's the question I didn't hear.

[00:38:53] Joe Souki: Most of these folks have mental illness or some other kind of disability.

[00:38:59] Randall Roth: Right. Jim, let's ask Joe. Joe, the question is if there's going to be a special session, the general question is how do you determine what issues are going to be looked at and the specific question is why not take a look at the amount of money that's going in general assistance to people who are disabled and and otherwise in need of help.

[00:39:17] Joe Souki: That is certainly a possibility that we look at that. We are all not very happy with that the the $217 a month for 24 months, and if there is any way we can resolve that we will. Go back to your your question again, it's determined by the house leadership meeting with the Senate leadership and meeting with the governor, and together we try to arrive as to what should be the issues. Personally, I would wanted to be only maybe a one issue item and that should be no no fault to the problem go and go in and out. But again we will look at maybe other issues like general assistance if there is more money. My understanding is that the council of revenues should be coming out very soon with a new estimate of of revenues and if there is any more we'll certainly look at it.

[00:40:14] Randall Roth: Okay. Thank you. Let's go to Ruth and Kailua. Good morning Ruth.

[00:40:18] Caller: Ruth can you hear me? Yes. Thank you.

[00:40:20] Randall Roth: You're on the air.

[00:40:22] Caller: Thank you. I saw the governor on television the other day and I don't believe that he should knock the Republicans, some of them voted for him.

[00:40:31] Randall Roth: Okay. That's a Let me just give a comment on that. That's a very good comment, Randy, and I'd also like to mention that Republicans get elected by Democrats voting for Republicans. And I think that people doing that are looking at what we stand for. We oppose the cuts in general assistance. And this is for Jim Brewer. The House Republicans opposed cutting general assistance to the mentally disabled. There are 4,000 people in that category. $217 a month is unconscionable. They can't put a roof over their heads. And what we're going to do is create more homeless. House Republicans stood strongly with the human service groups, trying to keep the funding up at the original level, the $400 level.

[00:41:14] Randall Roth: Okay, and I've got the Democrats wanting to say something about that but we're going to move on because just as soon as somebody goes off one line, somebody else grabs that line and so we're going to try to hear a lot of different voices. Let's go to Andrew in Makiki. Good morning Andrew.

[00:41:26] Caller: Aloha. How are here? Cowku to all of you. Do you feel that y'all have been doing a good job? Do you think like if you ask the general public, do you think they're satisfied with all your your work this last legislation?

[00:41:42] Randall Roth: No, I don't think the general public is satisfied. I'm going door to door in my district, and the general public very definitely is not satisfied. Deservedly so, we did not produce. It was a dud session. It was a fiasco. Let let me ask Joe. Let me ask Joe Suki. Joe, what are you hearing?

[00:41:59] Joe Souki: What I'm generally hearing now is as the message is is going out, I'm hearing very positive things that it was a good session that we did a lot and I think it's a ploy on the minority. And of course, you would expect them to grade us on apps and these, but let me say this, if I was to grade Cynthia, I will give her an F.

[00:42:26] Randall Roth: Okay. Thank you. That's because I oppose gambling, Joe. You are Well, you oppose everything on principle as long as it will look good to the public. And we move on to Hank in Honolulu. Good morning Hank.

[00:42:39] Caller: Good morning. The real issue on no fault is where do you want the money to go. The Hawaii economy is going down the drain and you got 150 million each year less in bodily injury payouts going to the mainland insurance company. If it went here to consumers and attorneys, at least people spend money in the Hawaii economy. You know the 1 and 10 rule if you spend 150 million here in the Hawaii economy, you got 10 times as much lawyers buy groceries, cars, houses as consumers do. So I think you got to look at the big picture and where that money is going.

[00:43:09] Randall Roth: Okay. Thank you Hank. Appreciate your call. Let's go to Bill in Makiki. Good morning Bill.

[00:43:13] Caller: Hi, good morning Randy. Um kind of two questions here. Since Hawaii and I think everybody knows it has so many complex issues, um not just this year, but in probably the next 10 to 20 years, why can't they stay in session uh longer to try to resolve as many as they can? And number two, is there a system for prioritization of the issues that come up each session?

[00:43:36] Randall Roth: Uh Joe Suki, can you respond to to Bill's questions very briefly?

[00:43:41] Joe Souki: [unintelligible — audio glitch] didn't hear the question, but I hear it very The first The first question is, why wouldn't the legislative session be longer? There's an awful lot to be done, and and only 60 working days is is not a very long period of time. Okay, constitutionally we're we're limited for 60 days, so we would have to to amend the the Constitution. Right now, we have included a lot of recess days just to make it longer because there's so much to do in so in so short of a time. In the event there is a constitutional convention, I think that question should be looked at. I think the society is very complex now, and it's very difficult to do do the people's work in this relatively short period of time.

[00:44:33] Randall Roth: The other part of the question was, was how does the prioritization get done? Who really makes the decisions in terms of what the legislation legislature is going to focus on? And and again, I know you could talk a long time about that, but Yeah, I I'll try to make it very brief. I'm speaking for the House of Representatives. We have have a majority package, and the way it's done, it's it's initiated through house leadership. goes to the policy committee, and then to the house majority. And then the house, the house majority will then amend or delete the the recommendations of the house house leadership and that we arrive at the the priorities. That's the basic mechanics in how to do it.

[00:45:21] Randall Roth: Joe, in in just one sentence, if if a an ordinary person with with no, you know, connections at all, feels strongly about something, in one sentence, what's the most important thing they can do to have an impact on the process you just described?

[00:45:37] Joe Souki: They should call my office.

[00:45:39] Randall Roth: Okay, there you have it. Thank you. We go to David in Mililani. Good morning David.

[00:45:46] Caller: Well, this is for the Democrats and you can consider this a call to your office, that, uh, uh, the first caller addressed the issue of shame about not passing High 3. I know Randy has a tendency not to let these questions be answered, but do any of the Democrats feel ashamed that you didn't pass High 3 legislation when all of us, or the vast majority wanted reform there. Do you feel ashamed about that?

[00:46:07] Randall Roth: Well, let's see, Terry Tom, do you feel ashamed on that particular score?

[00:46:12] Terry Tom: I wish we could have done something on it.

[00:46:14] Randall Roth: Okay, let's ask Milton Holt. Are you ashamed on that one?

[00:46:16] Milton Holt: I'm disappointed we didn't do anything about it.

[00:46:18] Joe Souki: How do you feel about not doing anything on the High 3 this year? I'm not disappointed at all because I believe the High 3 as it is paid only to the legislators, is very discriminatory because High 3 is enjoyed by all segments of government. They have High 3 in a private enterprise, and I think this is a has it's a focus of the the media and I can see some changes, but if there's going to be some change, it should be a change, it should go right across the board and not only be limited to legislators.

[00:46:55] Randall Roth: Cynthia, I know you've got something to say. If you promise one sentence.

[00:46:59] Cynthia Thielen: I think that the legislature to should take the lead and should eliminate High 3 benefits for ourselves.

[00:47:05] Randall Roth: Okay, we go to Lee in Makiki and and folks, please I appreciate you being patient with us. The the lines have been packed the whole time. I'm sure there are people trying to call in and haven't been able to get in. I'm going to try to get to as many people as I possibly can. We go to Lee in Makiki.

[00:47:21] Caller: Yes, an article in Friday's star bulletin indicated Senator Holt might be stripped of his committee chairmanship because he embarrassed Senate leadership by forcing a vote on the same sex bill. Does this mean that the Senate position on no fault and ultimately the fate of no fault in the special session could be determined by action on a totally unrelated issue?

[00:47:47] Randall Roth: And and Milton, before you respond to that, let let me just describe what I I think the context of this is. There was an article in the paper a couple of days ago where evidently Ros Baker, who's a fellow senator is seemingly forming some sort of of informal group that, to someone like me who's just reading the newspaper, it kind of looks like she's trying to wrestle the issue away from you. And I don't know if that's related to what you did or tried to do on same sex marriage or totally unrelated to that. Can you very briefly give us some sense for what's going on and how you feel about it?

[00:48:10] Milton Holt: As I understand it, um I received the memo from the Majority Leader just like every other senator. Um, that memo, the contents of that memo indicated that uh there was some interest on the part of some senators to have input into Auto Insurance Reform and that she would just be a conduit to receive those comments and that those comments would be forwarded to me as Chair of the committee.

[00:48:44] Randall Roth: How do you feel How do you feel about that?

[00:48:46] Milton Holt: Uh to me if it just helps the situation, I have no problem. I don't think she's trying to wrestle any bill away from me, or reorganize the Senate.

[00:48:56] Randall Roth: And you don't think you're being somehow punished for having done what we described earlier as an an end run trying to do something about same-sex marriage?

[00:49:04] Milton Holt: Well, I think uh you can call it an end run or whatever you want. I try to get the discussion moved along um Get the ball down field. move the ball down the field, that's right. but we uh No, I mean, I've been in a long time, I've been through a lot. I think that uh people are frustrated, however, uh the jurisdiction of no no fault insurance still lies within my committee, and I don't think the Majority Leader uh a letter or memo uh interferes with that at all.

[00:49:32] Randall Roth: Okay. You're listening to the Price of Paradise Radio show. My name is Randy Roth, my guests in the studio are Senator Milton Holt, and representatives Terry Tom and Cynthia Theiland. With us by phone is the Speaker of the House, Joe Suki. We're talking about the 1996 legislative session, and if you'd like to ask a question or make a brief comment, the number is 955-8821. The entire show will be replayed this evening beginning at 8 o'clock on KIFO 1380 AM, and if you watch the 6 and 10 o'clock news tonight on Channel 2, we think Beth Hillyer will probably have a report on this morning's showing. And you'll see this football that we've been alluding to this morning in our comments that Cynthia brought to the studio with her this morning.

[00:50:12] Randall Roth: We go to Duke in Waikiki. Good morning Duke.

[00:50:14] Caller: Good morning Randy. I have a question if we go to a special session, uh if you limited or can you limited to one or two issues or can uh different legislators then do end runs or move the goal post or whatever you want with this football metaphor and and change the issues inside the uh special session?

[00:50:36] Randall Roth: I people in the studio are nodding their heads, no, but I'll ask Joe Suki who's kind of at the center of all this. Joe, is there is there a possible way for people other than than leadership to bring up issues during a special session?

[00:50:48] Joe Souki: Well, they can always write, they can always write to me or to other members of the House of Representatives, but ultimately the choice will be made with the with the House majority and and the Senate because jointly the House and the Senate will have to agree.

[00:51:06] Randall Roth: So it's basically you and Norman Mizuguchi?

[00:51:09] Joe Souki: Uh, with with the backing of our respective majority.

[00:51:14] Randall Roth: Randy, what I meant was, can a a senator or a group uh got a bill that's there and change it, just like happened in the regular session.

[00:51:23] Milton Holt: Milton Holt is saying cannot.

[00:51:25] Randall Roth: No, you can't do it. It'll be limited so just to the subject matter that's agreed upon by both houses. Very correct. Thank you Duke. We go to Lloyd in Waikiki. Good morning Lloyd.

[00:51:33] Caller: Aloha. Yes, my comment is this: it's too bad that the that the Senate and the the House are doing bills to people that can't help themselves like the poor people that they've cut their benefits down to something they can't possibly live on. Get rid of the parade, uh things of that nature, which are should be held up there and we shouldn't be wasting our money on many other things and I I just think it's a shame that the people that can't speak up and don't have the the voice are being uh penalized. That's my comment.

[00:52:00] Joe Souki: Can I speak to that?

[00:52:01] Randall Roth: Sure, go ahead Joe Suki.

[00:52:03] Joe Souki: Okay. Well, [unintelligible — audio glitch] state of Hawaii still has one of the most attractive social programs in a whole in a whole nation. We have a health health program where over 97 percent of the people enjoy. We have a good program into aid to parents of dependent children and we've made some very minor changes in there. In fact, yeah we're so attractive, we get a lot of people coming here for the social services. So we're not anti people. We're pro people. In fact, that's been part of our problem and that's why we have such a huge debt now. When we when we we began this session, we began with a debt of 300 million dollars deficit that we had to adjust, and in this adjustments, we had to make a lot of cuts. It's it's very unfortunate, but we try to be as fair and humane as we could be as we went along.

[00:52:58] Randall Roth: It's certainly more fun spending the money than trying to to cut. Okay, well let's go to um Ivan in Punchbowl. Good morning Ivan.

[00:53:06] Caller: Ah, good morning. Um, I have been struck by the fact that young enthusiastic legislature seem to become disenchanted as they learn how powerful the committee chairmen are and feel they have no choice except to vote with them. I wonder if uh changing it from a bicameral to a unicameral legislation might lead some fresh air into the system and I address this question to um Suki.

[00:53:33] Joe Souki: Well, there would be a good idea if we start the House of Representative.

[00:53:38] Randall Roth: I think that's I want to say the House next year as well. Okay, thank you Ivan for your call. I'm I'm going to take your question mostly as a comment uh and I and I think it's a good one. Uh, let's go to Roy on the Big Island. Good morning Roy.

[00:53:52] Caller: Hi, thanks for having me on.

[00:53:54] Randall Roth: Roy, can you speak up a bit?

[00:53:55] Caller: Sorry, yeah I was driving by and listening on the radio and I pulled over to pay them.

[00:54:01] Randall Roth: Okay, if you could speak up a little bit that pay phone doesn't work really well.

[00:54:04] Caller: Okay. Um I just want to make a couple of comments here. uh I have to say what other people have said that I noticed you guys in the legislature managed managed to protect your own pension this year but you didn't cut welfare in half. And uh you didn't do anything about car insurance, and there's a lot of people here on the big island with old cars and they manage to keep them running and they test them out to stay safe inspection but they can't afford the insurance for And also there's a I think somebody made a comment that you work so hard and you put in 20 hour days Well, the rest of us when we have to go out and work, we uh we get judged on what we do.

[00:54:40] Randall Roth: Okay, Roy, thank you for your call. I really appreciate it. Let's go, let's go to Richard in Puna, Luu. Good morning, Richard.

[00:54:47] Caller: Good morning. Um I probably live as far as Tom from anybody else and lose much driving and I favored the paid the pump on a simple sense, and that the tourists everybody paid for it. And if you're retired, uh, if you can afford to buy the gas, you can afford to pay the insurance, you can afford to drive. It means you can own more than one car or whatever and there is no insurance problem or uncovered people. It was the most wonderful beautiful idea of Kaitales. And I don't see what's wrong with everybody not appreciating it and I live as far, and I've got over over 14,200,000 miles on my car, and I'm considering I won't be able to continue insurance to solve this problem.

[00:55:20] Randall Roth: Richard, thank you for your call. We really appreciate it. Folks, you're listening to the Price of Paradise radio show. We're last, we're down to the last 8 minutes, and what I'm going to do is take a break from all the calls, and I'm going to give each of our our guests, uh, and I've been frustrating them, I'm sure, because they've had things to say, but we've tried to hear a lot of different voices, so we've kept moving. I'm going to give each of my guests an opportunity to, do you either respond to something that was said earlier, or to bring up something new. Terry Tom, any thoughts?

[00:55:50] Terry Tom: Well, um, I just want to say that I from from my perspective, uh being a house member for the past 14 years has taught me a lot and I really really appreciated the kind of leadership that has been given by Speaker Suki. You know, we talk about a lot of issues, but no one talks about all the ethics reforms and campaign spending reforms that we've done in the past two years. We've we're one of the finest and strictest states in the country. No one talks about the ice reform we've made so that ice users, most of whom crimes are committed are by drug dealers on ice and users, and that that tough uh mandatory jail we're going to give. No one talks about the nuisance abatement uh statute that we've provided this year that will give community organizations the opportunity to go to court and get drug distributors and dealers out of their communities. No one talks about beach liability, where now a lot of the tax dollars are spent on people who don't use common sense and go in the water and get hurt, sue the counties and the state. No one talks about doubling the manslaughter from 10 to 20 years that we did the this year.

[00:57:00] Calvin Say: Let me ask you why why is that? Because you mentioned earlier probate reform, which as you know, that was kind of my baby this year. I worked hard on that and and was delighted to see you do what you did. And there hasn't been one word in the paper about that and there hasn't been much about the items that you mentioned. Why is it that the media will focus on on a few specific issues and and just ignore, I think you said there were 350 bills that did pass, will ignore most of those issues?

[00:57:27] Randall Roth: And it gets the public mad. It Well, first of all, I think it sells papers. They want they want they want they need the listeners to be the readers to the listeners. They need to readers of the newspapers to buy papers and any kind of controversy controversy that can be mounted they will do. But we do good things. I'm not I'm not here asking that we have a pat on the shoulder. I I'm here because I want to do the work, okay? I as a legislator, I think all of us sitting on this table want to do a good job, but by golly, I think there are uh you the sometimes read the media like like we haven't done anything during the 60 days. And you know what's so unfortunate is that the media, in many respects, shapes the minds and thoughts of the public. They have tremendous power and they have tremendous power to to have the media determine how we do, whether we do good or or badly. And and [unintelligible — audio glitch] really disappoints me that when we try to respond that we did in the last two years in issues dealing with ethics reforms and and campaign spending reforms for legislators that at that point after we've done all the work, not one peep from the media and and the probate, Randy, I pull this to you. This was just one of the 350 uh bills or one of the many 90 bills, at least for the judiciary, that we worked on, and I think you know as well as I do that we spent innumerable hours and hours meeting with you and your counterparts on just one bill. So you know, and not one peep about it from the media about what we did in this bill, which is going to really improve the quality of life for people. And so, I I it really uh I just want to say uh finally to those who are listening out there, we care and and we we do appreciate and want your input from the public. Okay, Cynthia, we've got just a minute or so each. I'll be quick. I'll be quick. You can't fool the people. It was not a good session. When we talk about have we made your home safer, your street safer, your community safer, we did do some positive steps, but the answer is no, we didn't do enough. Lack of leadership, we have not added more prison bed space. We're continuing the release of on furlough and on parole. We're continuing to release prisoners out into the community. I think it's wrong. I think with leadership, we would have said we need more bed space, instead of spending the money to send our prisoners to Texas. Provide the jobs locally, we had the P word, the privatization of building prisons. We had two companies here that are doing this nationally, that we're all they needed was state land and they could have built prison bed space for our community, kept the prisoners here, kept the jobs here, and also kept this open revolving prison door from happening. Right now, we're letting people out that should not be out on the streets and our police department has said that to us in committee hearings again and again and again.

[01:00:30] Caller: Hi, thank you very much, Randy. First of all, I want to thank you and the public for taking such an interest in in government, and I want to repeat that it was a very good session. This is the first time in the 14 years that I've been in government that we've been able to cut cut the budget, rather substantially. Uh we cut the general funds, approximately 5 5%. Unfortunately, that 5 5% spelled out in lost jobs, people losing their jobs, programs being lost. And I hope that as we move along, that we that uh that the the economy will be pick we'll we'll be picking up so that we can replace some of these lost lost programs that are uh very important to the people of the state. In closing, I I want to echo what uh representative Tom has stated that the the media uh had focused itself on uh just just a couple items. And uh it towards the end, it seemed that there was a sort of vindictiveness on the part of of the uh uh of of the media on the legislature, and I think there was no call for that because the members of the of the legislature, for the most part, are very dedicated, they work very hard, they do good work. And and and God bless you all out there.

[01:01:58] Milton Holt: 30 seconds you got. 30 seconds, I'm glad that Cynthia brought the football because uh as we know important football games will go into overtime. And I can use this football, I still believe in a Senate position, I think we still need to serve the people we represent. I think the uh uh Speaker Suki, I mean Speaker Suki out there, I think we should have a special session, you might be hearing from me shortly. Um we we are both agree to repeal the existing system, and we might even end up eliminating the mandatory insurance in its entirety. And I lose 100% savings for the people in the state, bye.

[01:02:12] Randall Roth: people we represent. I think the, speaker, I mean speaker Suki out there, I think we should have a special session. You might be hearing from me shortly. We we both agree to repeal the existing system, and we might even end up eliminating mandatory insurance in its entirety.

[01:02:29] Calvin Say: Okay. And produce 100% savings for the people of the state. Bye.

[01:02:32] Randall Roth: Thank you Milton Hulk, Terry Tom, Joe Suki, and Cynthia Thiland. You've been listening to the Praise of Paradise radio show. Our producer is Susie Roth. Our director of operations is Jeff Elarding. Next week an exciting show, Charles Meminger, Honolulu Light, Star Bulletin columnist, and former Governor John Waihe'e. It's going to be a good one. Aloha. Thank you, Milton. Holt, Terry, Tom, Joe Suki and Cynthia Thielen. You've been listening to Praise of Paradise Radio Show. Our producer is Susie Roth. Our director of operations is Jeff Alarding. Next week, an exciting show, Charles Memminger, Honolulu Light Star bulletin columnist and former Governor John Way Hey, it's going to be a good one, Aloha.