Candidates for Prosecutor on Hawaii's Criminal Justice System
Price of Paradise · Hawaii Public Radio · aired 1996-06-16
Guests: Randal Yoshida (former supervising deputy prosecutor; candidate for Prosecuting Attorney); Peter B. Carlisle (former supervising deputy prosecutor; candidate for Prosecuting Attorney); David Arakawa (former supervising deputy prosecutor; candidate for Prosecuting Attorney)
Duration: 1:04:56

[0:00:01] Randall Roth: Aloha. This is Randy Roth, host of the Price of Paradise Radio Show. We're broadcast live each Sunday morning at 8:00 on KHPR 88.1 FM and KKUA 90.7 FM and then again at 8:00 in the evening on KIFO 1380 AM. Actually, I just said we're broadcast live each Sunday morning. This morning is a little bit different. Usually, we are broadcast live and calls are invited. Today's show, however, is being recorded earlier in the week for replay on Sunday morning and then again Sunday evening.
[0:00:32] Randall Roth: Our topic today is Hawaii's criminal justice system and our guests are three fellows who are running for prosecuting attorney for the County of Honolulu. Their names are David Arakawa, Peter Carlisle, and Randall Yoshida. David Arakawa was born in 1955, grew up as a third-generation member of the Arakawa family in Waipahu. After Waipahu elementary school, David attended and graduated from Punahou School and the University of Hawaii.
[0:01:00] Randall Roth: In 1979, he enrolled in the UH William S. Richardson School of Law and received his law degree in 1981. David married Bertha Oshiro in 1982. They have two children, Aaron and Galen. By juggling their busy working schedules, David and Bertha find time for Aiea soccer, Kamali'i Manoa volleyball, and Manoa boys and girls athletics as well as other community activities. Peter Carlisle, after graduating from UCLA Law School in 1977, was hired by Honolulu police chief Francis K. Keala, sorry, as a law clerk. He then became a deputy prosecutor in the Oahu career criminal unit and rose to administer administer the union.
[0:01:44] Randall Roth: He was further promoted to head of the felony trial division and supervised most of Honolulu's felony cases for six years. Peter is currently a partner in the Shim, Tam and Chang law firm and an adjunct professor of law at UH William S. Richardson School of Law. He is married with two children. Randall Yoshida earned his undergraduate degree at USC and law degree from the University of Hawaii William S. Richardson School of Law. Now I've heard that before. We've got a commonality here. He was a division chief in the prosecutor's office under Charles Marsland, chief administrator for the Honolulu Liquor Commission, and chair of the Hawaii State Board of Education.
[0:02:23] Randall Roth: Currently, Randall is a senior partner in the law firm of Yoshida and Ching. Well, David, Peter, and Randall, good morning.
[0:02:31] David Arakawa: Aloha. Good morning.
[0:02:32] Peter B. Carlisle: Good morning.
[0:02:32] Randall Roth: You know, I'm confused. It's not morning, it's evening, but it's going to be heard by most of our listeners Sunday morning. Our topic is Hawaii's criminal justice system and the three of you are running for the office of prosecutor. I know you've given an awful lot of thought to to the system and a lot of our listeners, I think are quite concerned that crime is up in Hawaii. It's up especially in in the violent crime category this last year, and it's been an extremely high compared to most places in the United States in the property crime area for quite a few years.
[0:03:06] Randall Roth: Let's start with David since alphabetically you're number one. David, why is crime up so much in Hawaii? How big of a problem is crime in Hawaii? What would you as prosecutor be able to do about that?
[0:03:21] David Arakawa: I believe crime is one of the most serious problems we face today in Honolulu. Um the lack of prison space is compromising our public safety and order. Without the threat of prison, criminals will not respect the law. If offenders can't be incarcerated, they will commit more crimes, victimized more people and add more cases to the system. Randy, few people know this but our property crime rate in Honolulu is second worst in the nation, only be behind Washington D.C. and that's because we don't have enough prison space for our criminals. This is a dangerous threat to our visitor industry since tourists are the favorite targets of this type of crime.
[0:04:02] David Arakawa: As prosecuting attorney, I do everything I could to persuade our legislators, the governor and the community to give more prison space a higher priority. To keep the prison population down, I'd utilize programs like the drug court to divert certain first-time offenders from prison and into treatment and support more drug treatment and rehabilitation programs for prisoners. So lack of prison space and drugs seem to be our primary problems here.
[0:04:30] Randall Roth: Okay. Peter Carlisle, any thoughts on on the question itself or or David's response to the question?
[0:04:36] Peter B. Carlisle: In the last two weeks, we heard reports of three wives who were killed by their husbands. There was a teenage driver of a stolen car shot to death by the police. In another incident, a police officer's nose was broken and shots were exchanged, the use of ice crystal methamphetamines dominates all news media. Honolulu is more and more becoming like Los Angeles, Newark, New Jersey and other urban crime zones. We need change in the criminal justice system, Randy, and we need it now.
[0:05:13] Peter B. Carlisle: Our juvenile justice system has run out of space and the system is run behind closed doors. The public and the media don't get the opportunity to see what happens. There's inadequate follow up regarding domestic abusers, and with drugs nobody is brave enough to confront use.
[0:05:33] Randall Roth: Do you agree with with David that the primary problem is the lack of prison space?
[0:05:38] Peter B. Carlisle: The primary problem is drugs fueling crime.
[0:05:40] Randall Roth: Okay. Uh Randall Yoshida, you've got a couple responses that you can comment on or your general response to the question of of why crime is so high, uh especially of late and and what can be done about it?
[0:05:53] Randal Yoshida: There are two basic reasons why crime is so high. Number one is because of the widespread use and distribution of drugs. There's no question about that. The second thing is because of repeat offenders being returned back onto the streets.
[0:06:09] Randal Yoshida: And that's why it's so important because the prosecuting attorney is the chief law enforcement officer for Honolulu. That's why it's so important that the prosecutor not only have a vision in how to solve the crime problem, but also have an action plan, which I have in how to solve the crime problem. We plan to put together elite teams of prosecuting attorneys and veteran police officers who are going to attack the crime the crime problem in our our community. We have to be proactive. It's the traditional methods and approaches to solving crime is just not working. We have to be a lot more aggressive and that's how you attack that crime problem.
[0:06:48] Randall Roth: Okay. Peter Carlisle, a minute ago you mentioned that there was recently a a young man 16 years old, I believe, who was uh in a stolen car, uh trying to get away from police, unarmed, uh ended up being shot fatally. Uh any thoughts on that?
[0:07:04] Peter B. Carlisle: I don't think I have enough facts to give you uh the type of response that I'd like to. Uh obviously we're very concerned about the allegations that uh the individual was trying to use the car to ram police vehicles. By the same token, we're similarly concerned about the fact that it is an unarmed juvenile who was shot for what was amounting to at least in terms of the stolen car, a property offense. So I think that we need to have more facts before we can make an intelligent response as to what our reaction is to that particular problem.
[0:07:33] Randall Roth: Okay. David, do you have any thoughts about that particular event or about uh car, uh thiefs in general or or police response to um uh any sort of crime that they come upon?
[0:07:45] David Arakawa: You know, first of all Randy, I I think it was a very tragic incident both for uh the family of the young boy who was killed and um for the law enforcement officers, okay? Again, I agree with uh the other council that, yeah we don't have enough facts right now to give, you know, to give a responsible comment uh on that particular case.
[0:08:07] David Arakawa: But auto theft is one of our primary problems um in Honolulu and it's fueled again by drugs. You know, a lot of the car thefts can be tied to drug-related burglaries or drug-related drug deals. And what the legislature did this session is they made car theft one of the crimes that would make um criminals eligible for enhanced sentencing as a repeat offender. So they recognized it the legislature did for the first time recognizing car theft as a serious crime, and if an offender has two, three, four, five car thefts, they'd be eligible to be sentenced as a repeat offender.
[0:08:46] Randall Roth: Okay. Randall, any thoughts about the original question or or the responses of either of your opponents?
[0:08:52] Randal Yoshida: Drugs and gangs, auto theft, they're all too common today. Currently, today, each day in this community, we have over 60 auto thefts. This is just one incident where we had a person who stole a vehicle, tried to ram a police officer. What we're finding with the uh wide distribution and use of drugs is we're finding that the criminals are becoming a lot more aggressive, not only uh uh in terms of in what happens in our community, but also a lot more aggressive against police officers.
[0:09:27] Randal Yoshida: Uh that's a widespread problem. We have to put a stop to that. I will put a stop to that and the bottom line is when this these things happen in our community where we have police officers now being their lives being threatened, we have to attack the problem and right now.
[0:09:43] Randall Roth: Okay. Well, one common theme in in all of your responses seems to be drugs. Uh there are some people who say, we're losing the war on drugs. We've done everything we can to try to address that problem uh and it doesn't seem to be working. What's your reaction to people like that, Randall?
[0:10:00] Randal Yoshida: Well, there's there's a lot that can be done in the area of drugs. We have a two-prong action plan. The first prong is you have to proactively investigate. What I mean by proactively is you target drug distributors, these people who are profiting from crime, these people who are making millions and millions of dollars off of the distribution of drugs. These people who don't even care whether the drugs are being sold to the community, to the children in our schools.
[0:10:31] Randal Yoshida: We have to target them. We have to save some space in prison for them. The second thing we have to do is we have to educate them. We have to educate young people about the harmful effects of drugs. We also have to educate people about gangs, that they're alternatives to gangs, and that if you choose to be in a gang uh you're going to be held accountable.
[0:10:54] Randall Roth: Are are we not doing those things right now?
[0:10:56] Randal Yoshida: I think we have to aggressively do it a lot more. I don't think we're targeting drug distributors enough. And I think we have to aggressively go after them and that's what I'm going to do.
[0:11:06] Randall Roth: Okay. David Arakawa, the problem of drugs, you know, we we're all upset by it. What specifically can and and would you do as prosecutor?
[0:11:14] David Arakawa: I beg to differ. I think the police and the prosecutor's office are doing a good job and are trying hard to get to the source of drugs, to target the drug dealers. I mean, that's what the police department and the prosecutor's office is doing. It's not enough just to target drug dealers. You have to have a multi-prong approach and one difference between myself and the others is that I've been continuously involved in the criminal justice system and criminal law cases for the past 15 years.
[0:12:04] David Arakawa: You also need rehabilitation. It's a multi-prong approach because those drug guys, drug dealers, or defendants that go into prison, they have a drug problem. You can't just let them out. They'll still have that same drug problem. So it's a multi-prong approach.
[0:12:20] Randall Roth: Okay. Peter Carlisle, we're talking about drugs, what can you do? What would you do?
[0:12:24] Peter B. Carlisle: Everything you've heard is nothing new. Uh basically, the classic approach is eradication, interdiction, education with prevention and rehabilitation and then enforcement. The focus of the problem with drugs, we keep on hearing the same go after the drug dealers, go after the drug dealers. We've been going after drug dealers for decades and decades. Uh including getting them in for life which I've done. Okay.
[0:13:07] David Arakawa: Okay, I forgot to mention Randy. What what we need to do for the drug problem is you need to dismantle the drug operation. You need to use it. It's like a business, so you have to attack it financially, using the money laundering statutes, the racketeering statutes, and also the forfeiture statutes. So it's not good enough to just cut off the head of this dragon. You need to dismantle it financially.
[0:13:35] Peter B. Carlisle: They've been doing that over on the on the federal side for years as well, using RICO statutes, basically the racketeering influence and corrupt organization statute is used to bleed basically the money out of the organization. Use is the key.
[0:13:51] Randal Yoshida: When you take a look at the drug interdiction program, uh what happens on the state level, when I say aggressively prosecute and target these drug distributors, again, these people are making millions and millions and millions of dollars off of young kids in our schools, buying and using drugs.
[0:14:14] Randal Yoshida: With limited resources, and that's why it's so important that the prosecutor have the administrative background like I have to really take a look at how you use your resources. If you take a look at we have limited resources and take a look at the overall picture, how are you going to spend your resources? You have to spend your resources and taking out those guys who are making the big bucks, who are profiting off of the criminal activity like this.
[0:14:41] Randal Yoshida: What has happened on the federal level is that they've gone at using the target method, going after these big drug dealers. It has never really been fully implemented on the state level. We are going to do that with limited resources and we're going to uh take out those programs. We're going to have uh their assets forfeited and then make sure that those assets when they're forfeited go to further government law enforcement uh programs.
[0:15:07] David Arakawa: Okay. David Arakawa, occasionally I hear about someone who's been repeatedly arrested, sometimes dozens of times, and yet they're out on the street committing some crime. We usually uh read about it when it's a a violent crime, and I wonder how in the world can somebody be arrested dozens of time and still be out on the street. Is there an explanation or is there something that as prosecutor you could do about that?
[0:15:32] David Arakawa: First Randy, there's a difference between arrests and convictions. Okay, but to answer your question in 1995, in December 1995, uh the prison warden for OCCC, the Wahoo Community Correction Facility, made a statement for the media and said that between 130 and 140 dangerous criminals, criminals that the court regarded as dangerous and the prisons regarded as dangerous, were released from OCCC. They were furloughed from OCCC and um the prison administrator said these were criminals that they did not want released, but were forced to release due to prison overcrowding. These prisoners, 130 to 140 convicted felons had an average of 11 prior arrests and almost 40%, 38% of them were re-arrested.
[0:16:24] Randall Roth: So that again comes back to prison space?
[0:16:27] David Arakawa: It comes back to prison space and the fact that our prisons are releasing dangerous criminals not because they want to, but because of prison overcrowding, and these prisoners are furloughed early. They call it furlough and they're let out early.
[0:16:40] Randal Yoshida: Any thoughts on that, either the same or different? There are several things that we can do. We don't have to build um major multimillion dollar maximum security prisons. What I suggest is that we do exactly what they just did in Waiava where where we build uh shelters permanent enough to house those criminals who should be in prison. There has to be some penalty to criminal actions. And I think that if we have swift justice and a definite penalty, we will definitely see the crime rate go down. I think that's what we we need. Uh in terms of uh prison bed space, uh uh as far as I'm concerned, stack them up.
[0:17:24] Randall Roth: Okay. Okay. Peter Carlisle?
[0:17:26] Peter B. Carlisle: In 1978, an elite prosecutorial unit was formed on the island of Oahu called the Oahu Career Criminal Unit. It focused on repeat offenders with the theory of incapacitation through incarceration. In 1980, the legislature passed mandatory sentencing. It was used by the Career Criminal Unit and its then head to target repeat offenders. Within five years, crime had dropped by 17,000 in number. From 1980 to 1985, there were 17,000 fewer felonies. The person in charge of that unit was, surprisingly enough, Peter Carlisle.
[0:18:06] Randall Roth: Okay. Uh we want to remind listeners that this is the Price of Paradise Radio Show. We're talking about ways of improving Hawaii's criminal justice system. Guests in the studio are our three candidates for prosecutor for the County of Honolulu. We have David Arakawa, Peter Carlisle, and Randall Yoshida. Uh each of the three is a lawyer. Uh David and Randall graduate from the University of Hawaii School of Law and Peter graduated from UCLA. Uh Peter is teaching uh courses out at the the University of Hawaii School of Law. So they all have a connection with the Richardson School of Law.
[0:18:40] Randall Roth: Usually we take calls, but this show was recorded earlier in the week. You're listening to it on Sunday and we're not taking any calls on Sunday. So we invite you just to sit back and and take it all in. Uh David Arakawa or I guess I asked you the last question, so I'll shift over to Peter Carlisle.
[0:18:56] Peter B. Carlisle: Um, you know, I'm listening to this and and it sounds good.
[0:19:00] Randal Yoshida: from all three directions, and I'm wondering, as a a voter here on this island, um how do I go about distinguishing uh the three of you? Why would somebody vote for Peter Carlyle as opposed to the other two? Is there something unique about your position, your approach? Tell me in a minute.
[0:19:17] Peter B. Carlisle: It's easy to sound good, it's harder to do good. What is going to be a good predictor for how successful one is a prosecutor in the future, is how successful one was in the past of being a prosecutor. Our next prosecutor should be the person with the most experience as a prosecutor, not as a criminal defense attorney, not as an administrator in some other government job.
[0:19:41] Randal Yoshida: You're pointing to the other two fellas at the table.
[0:19:43] Peter B. Carlisle: uh in in theory, maybe. I thought we were on radio, so I thought it was safe.
[0:19:48] Randal Yoshida: Okay.
[0:19:50] Peter B. Carlisle: But the key is experience as a prosecutor, not as something else.
[0:19:54] Randal Yoshida: Okay. You worked for Charles Marsland?
[0:19:57] Peter B. Carlisle: I was originally hired by Francis Keala of the police department as a law clerk. I was attached to the prosecutor's office. I was then hired full-time as a DPA by Togu Nakagawa. I then became uh a an administrator under the Marsland regime. I was the director of the Oahu career criminal unit for, I believe, two to three years. I was the uh third in line behind Marsland as the uh head of the trials division.
[0:20:22] Randal Yoshida: Was Marsland, in your mind, kind of a model? Is is that somebody that you thought was doing a particularly good job as prosecutor?
[0:20:29] Peter B. Carlisle: I think one of the things that you have to look at is the record. What do the facts show? During the administration of Marsland, crime at one point hit a 10-year low.
[0:20:40] Randal Yoshida: Okay, so that's a yes?
[0:20:41] Peter B. Carlisle: That's that's that's a qualified yes.
[0:20:43] Randal Yoshida: Okay. Uh David Arakawa, um what distinguishes you? Why should I as a voter on this island, vote for you uh and in addition to answering that, if there's anything that you heard your worthy opponent, Peter Carlyle, say that you'd like to comment on, feel free to do that as well. You've got a minute or so to do it.
[0:21:02] David Arakawa: Okay. Um some people running for this office would say trial experience is important. Others would say administrative experience, and not trial experience is important. I say both are important and I have both.
[0:21:16] David Arakawa: I was a prosecutor in that very career criminal unit that uh my opponent has talked about, we prosecuted career criminals. I was also an organized crime prosecutor. Mr. Carlyle didn't talk about that, but I tried murder, rape cases, organized crime cases. I prosecuted on one 20 jury trials over 20 jury trials. I never lost a jury trial. I've been actively involved in criminal cases for the past 15 years, and I have the most current broad experience with every component of the criminal justice system. For the past 15 years, I've worked with the police, the courts, probation department, department of public safety and the parolling authority.
[0:21:54] Randal Yoshida: What about on the issues? Is is there one thing in particular that you would do that you don't think your opponents would do? Because you've been on other platforms with them, you've got a sense for what they're all about. Uh is there anything in particular that you see yourself as bringing to the table that's unique?
[0:22:09] David Arakawa: Well, I'm not a politician and I'm I'm a workhorse. I'm not a showhorse, okay? So I'm not out for the glory, but what I want to do in particular is go back to the community and work with the community to help fight crime and go to the legislature, work with the legislators and that's something I think that will be very, very crucial in the coming years to fight crime, working with the community and the legislature, and I have the background to do both.
[0:22:34] Randal Yoshida: Randall Yoshida, you've just heard Peter Carlyle tell us why we should vote for him, and David Arakawa do the same, um what about you?
[0:22:42] Randal Yoshida: I'm glad they said that because they're distinct differences between myself and my opponents. I have been involved in some of the most complex cases involving being prosecuted by the prosecutor's office. I have also been involved in year-long prosecutions of public corruption, uh white-collar crime. Hey, everybody has trial experience. I think that's a wash. The bottom line is you have to take a look at what the prosecutor's office does, what it is, what does the prosecuting attorney do? The prosecuting attorney is responsible for an 14 over 14 million budget, the prosecuting attorney sets the vision for the office. The prosecuting attorney is responsible for a staff of over 100 deputy prosecutors. Are you talking about a trial lawyer, or are you talking about a person who not only has prosecution experience, but also has is a top administrator who has top management experience and can set the vision? The bottom line is my job will be to hire trial lawyers. And I will go on the community and hire the best trial lawyers to make sure the program works. I also have have a public service commitment. I've been in public service and prosecution most of my life. Excuse me. Excuse me. Not most of my life, but most of my legal career. Uh of course I wasn't the a prosecutor when I was a young kid, right? But the Maybe in spirit. In spirit. It was always a prosecutor when I was uh behind um my crib bars, I guess. Okay. Okay. Uh also, I have the working relationship with the police department and the police rank and file police officers, I have been endorsed by Shoppo and I think that you need that type of close working relationship to get the job done.
[0:24:28] Randal Yoshida: As I as I listening to you, it sounds as though you would be more or less like Keith Kaneshiro in the sense that you would be what I think of as as an administrator who hires people who go out and and do the thing in the courtroom that you wouldn't actually be trying cases yourself. That's what Chuck Marsland, uh Chuck Marsland and Keith Kaneshiro were both administrators. Now Chuck he he had a lot of trial experience, he's uh he wanted to go to trial, but the bottom line is his administrative responsibilities, his legislative responsibilities uh were so encompassing that that was a full-time job.
[0:25:03] Randal Yoshida: Let me ask Peter and David just very, very briefly, how important in your minds is it for the prosecutor himself to be in the courtroom on a regular basis? Very important, unimportant, somewhere in between. Quick answer. David Arakawa.
[0:25:18] David Arakawa: I don't believe that the prosecutor's primary function would be a trial attorney. I think his function would be more administrative, however, right. I do believe that to be the head of that office, Mr. Yoshida has to recognize that a prosecutor should have at least tried a murder, at least tried a rape, at least tried a serious crime, you know, for the respect of the deputies under him. They cannot have a guy who only did burglaries or theft cases.
[0:25:45] Randal Yoshida: Okay. Peter Carlyle, very quickly, how important is it for the prosecutor to be in the courtroom himself?
[0:25:49] Peter B. Carlisle: If you want to lead by example, rather than just by words, you have to go out there and set the example. That includes going to to court. The age of the DA DAs include Giuliani out of New York, the Southern District. He was a trial guy. All the big guys are because that way, they earn the respect of the people who they work with.
[0:26:14] Randal Yoshida: Okay. Randall Yoshida, it seems to me, just reading the newspapers and and watching the news on TV, that people who commit crimes are getting younger, or at least they're an awful lot of 16, 17, 18-year-olds out there uh doing very serious crimes. Um is that a pattern and and what specifically can you do about that including, as I understand it, if they're under 19, they can do anything including murder and they have to be released at age 19. Okay, and I've asked a lot all in once. Uh pick what you want to pick from and and give me uh your best shot. Okay, so first of all, let me uh comment on uh what the Mr. Carlyle and the Sarah said about the trial experience. Let me It's interesting they said that because they just basically acknowledged that I'm the only guy who has broad administrative experience who can do the job. Uh we're not talking about a trial lawyer. We're talking about a person who sets the vision, gets the resources, make sure that every trial prosecution is well done, and that's what we basically can do. Let me answer the question regarding uh juvenile crime. Okay. Uh I was head of the juvenile crime division uh in the prosecutor's office uh under Chuck Marsland and you're right, crime is getting uh offenders of of crime are getting younger and younger and younger and it has a lot to do with gangs. It has a lot to do with drugs. Uh gangs are very involved with drugs and I think that what we have to do, and I what I would do immediately, is throughout the years, crime has been, uh these young juvenile offenders, what they've done is uh they've been adjudicated behind closed doors, and I think that the system in the family court has to be opened up. We have to show what's happening in family court. We have to make sure that the media is well aware of what's going on in in family court, what kind of sentences, what kind of prosecutions they have. I think the court system will be a lot more accountable to the public.
[0:28:17] Randal Yoshida: Okay. Peter Carlyle, let me ask you first to respond to that specific suggestion that that the system should be opened up, even when it's a a minor who's in the courtroom. Uh any thoughts on that and then I want to ask you the broader question.
[0:28:29] Peter B. Carlisle: Yes and no. Okay, the answer is it would be okay to do that after a couple of strikes if you're talking about non-violent, not serious offenses. Okay. So only in those cases where they've committed multiple or particularly vicious crimes. No, no, no, no, it would be more inclusive than that. You would have a cut-off point and at that point the system opens up.
[0:28:48] Randal Yoshida: Okay, David, very briefly, a response to to Randall's suggestion that it that it be opened up, and then I want to ask you and and Peter to respond to the the broader question. Okay. I think there's already something in the system which allows that, not I think, I know, it's called the waiver process and and they didn't talk about that. If a juvenile is over the age of 16 and commits a serious felony and um the court deems that the family court cannot no longer service um that juvenile, he can be waived, or he can be tried as an adult then his case becomes public. And that those are for repeat offenders or particularly serious offenses. So there's already a way to open it up.
[0:29:29] Randal Yoshida: Okay. Well, I asked uh Randall the the broader question of how do we address the the problem with with youth and and the sing the the the the fact that they're committing more crimes and and more vicious crimes. Peter Carlyle. Let me go back and first respond to something that was said. I I'd like to clear it up. I don't usually appreciate people putting words in my mouth, and I never suggested that I did not have or admit that I did not have uh administrative experience as a prosecutor. For several years I was the head of the career criminal unit. For many years, I was the head of the felony trials division. That type of experience is not shared by any of the other candidates.
[0:34:31] Peter B. Carlisle: and therefore, being an administrator at the Board of Education or the liquor Commission, has nothing to do with being a prosecutor.
[0:34:38] Randal Yoshida: Okay. What do we do about uh all the crimes being committed by the young people in our community? Uh resources are tight obviously, and um we can't do everything. What what do we do with our precious resources? Let me give you a model. Okay, three strikes and you're out. The first strike, you get the family involved. It's used and not just the immediate family because it could be dysfunctional. A system that they've used in jurisdiction such as New Zealand is to use the extended family to assist. Strike number two, bring in the professionals. Rehabilitation and specialists in uh vocation, education, drug rehabilitation. Strike three, you bounce them upstairs and treat them like an adult.
[0:35:18] Randal Yoshida: Okay. David Arakawa.
[0:35:20] David Arakawa: Again, I think it's a multi prong approach for juveniles. I think we need to work on prevention. The prosecutor's office can assist um the various public service agencies in the schools in doing that and I believe the prosecutor's office needs to work with the schools on prevention. Secondly, there's a need for tough sentencing. We need to hold these juveniles accountable for their crimes if they're over 16, or I'm in favor of lowering the waiver age to 14 by the way. And if they're to be tried as an adult to hold them accountable and they'll be subject to criminal penalties just as adults are. And I also believe in rehabilitation, Randy. These are juveniles and some of them can be rehabilitated. I think there should be counseling not only for the youth, but also for the youth's family because a lot of times the youth is taken out of their family situation, counseled and is brought to a a point where the authorities think they're rehabilitated, then put back in the home where the mother's on ice, the father's doing other drugs and you know, that just defeats the purpose.
[0:36:24] Randal Yoshida: Okay. You know, you you bring up the notion of rehabilitation uh and and a lot of people I think feel that there are a number of things that can and should be done to to prevent kids from um uh going into drugs or crime or what have you. But the reality is we have we have limited resources. Um if we can't do prevention and rehabilitation and have more prison space, um what do we do first? David Arakawa.
[0:36:49] David Arakawa: I think first and foremost, we need to protect the public. We need to protect the public against dangerous criminals. And right now, the Hawaii youth correctional facility has 30 beds. It used to have 90 beds and now they're finding that the 30 beds are not enough to house the dangerous criminals. So if they if they're out of space and we've got a dangerous young person, what happens to them? They're released. Right now, there's a move afoot to increase the number of beds because they've realized that um we have a lot of dangerous juveniles out there.
[0:37:21] Randal Yoshida: So you like prevention and you like um uh rehabilitation, but first and foremost protect the public and that means more prison space. That's correct. Peter Carlyle.
[0:37:31] Peter B. Carlisle: You have to take a look at how much they've put into each one of those 30 beds. That facility costs $13 million. If you divide $13 million by 30, you come up with $433,000 per bed. My house does not have beds that are that expensive. I know a few people in Hawaii who do. So obviously there has been a misallocation in terms of the expense of construction for a limited amount of
[0:38:00] Randall Roth: space for needed incarceration of dangerous criminals.
[0:38:04] Randal Yoshida: So if we approach that differently, we can have more prison space without necessarily spending the kind of money we spent in the past.
[0:38:11] Randall Roth: heaven forbids that we ever walk down that road again.
[0:38:15] Randal Yoshida: Randall Yoshida. It's the question that the bed space should be reserved for those who commit violent offenses or who deserve to be in prison. We should save those bed spaces for those type of people. I think there are a lot of other alternatives, for example, like these tent camps. I think that those are examples of very inexpensive ways to incarcerate people. We also have many other alternatives like bracelets where the person is restricted to their home. We also have other alternatives that are a lot more inexpensive, for example, halfway houses.
[0:38:52] Randal Yoshida: That there is some penalty, they aren't able to roam the streets, they're held accountable, and I think that those are less expensive alternatives to your maximum security facility.
[0:39:04] Randall Roth: Okay. You're listening to the Price of Paradise radio show. My name is Randy Roth, and I'm here with the three candidates for prosecutor for the City and County of Honolulu, David Arakawa. He's an attorney with his own firm and a graduate of the William S. Richardson School of Law here at the University of Hawaii. Peter Carlisle, who is an attorney with Shim, Tam, and Chang, and a graduate of UCLA, and Randal Yoshida, who also graduated from the University of Hawaii, and he is an attorney with Yoshida and Chang. Uh, usually we take calls, but this show was recorded earlier in the week and so we're not taking calls this morning.
[0:39:38] Randall Roth: If you tuned in late and you'd like to catch the show in its entirety, it's going to be replayed this evening on KIFO, that's 1380 AM, and we would encourage you to check that out. Well, we've been talking about Hawaii's criminal justice system, and one particularly controversial issue that, um, you as as prosecutor, and I'm talking to to the three of you together, uh, the prosecutor can't personally do this, but your, um, somebody in this room's predecessor, Keith Kaneshio, has has gone public in pushing hard for, uh, the death penalty.
[0:40:14] Randall Roth: And I'm just curious where each of you is on on that particular issue and if you don't think that's relevant as a candidate for prosecutor, you can tell us that and tell us why. Let's start with Randal Yoshida.
[0:40:26] Randal Yoshida: In limited circumstances, for example, if a person is a multiple killer, uh, we've had a serial killer like that who, who's killed a number of women in the Moanalua area, uh, for those people who are contract killers, for those people who murder law enforcement officers or judges uh performing their duties, I think I'm for the death penalty. Uh, if you are talking about whether I'm going to go to the legislature and testify, or try to introduce a bill for the death penalty, you know, my, my, my I'm going to concentrate right now, in making sure that the criminal justice system works.
[0:41:06] Randal Yoshida: To make sure that we have violent criminals, to make sure we have, people who are committing multiple property crimes. I'm going to make sure that our streets are safe right now. I'm going to address them immediate problems right now because they have to be addressed. Drugs, gangs are out of control right now. I want to make sure that those immediate problems are addressed first before we go on to any other type of legislation.
[0:41:26] Randall Roth: Okay. So in limited form, you're for the death penalty, but that's not a high priority item.
[0:41:30] Randal Yoshida: That's correct.
[0:41:31] Peter B. Carlisle: Peter Carlisle. I can think of a number of cases where the emotionalism of it makes you want to feel like a death penalty might be appropriate. For example, killing a small child, taking it from a party, slaughtering the child, drowning it and putting it in a shallow grave. However, as policy, the death penalty for Hawaii would not be a wise move. To get, uh, the death penalty, you would have to expend political capital. There are so many other things now that need to be done other than blindly chasing after the death penalty, that you would lose focus on what you really need to focus on in terms of correcting the criminal justice system.
[0:42:14] Peter B. Carlisle: Also, the way it is imposed in America does not make any, uh, sense in terms of impact. It takes years and years to impose a death penalty. It costs millions and millions of dollars in appeals, in defense attorneys. As a result, for policy reasons right now, it does not make sense.
[0:42:31] Randall Roth: Okay. David Arakawa, the death penalty.
[0:42:34] David Arakawa: I would be in favor, Randy, of the death penalty in limited circumstances. Serial killers, multiple killers, contract or hired killers. And the reason why is we need to protect the public. We need to protect the public from these types of criminals. They're murderers, there are no there is no deterrent for these murders. They've killed before and they'll kill again. I do not see it as a a a number one item. There are other issues that need to be done. It would be part of the legislative packet. Okay. If I'm elected prosecutor.
[0:43:08] Randall Roth: Uh David Arakawa, again. Um what seems to be a big problem and a growing problem here and in other places but I get the impression especially here is domestic violence. And uh once in a while we'll read about somebody who, uh, has been involved in some form of domestic violence and and and told to go to anger management classes or something and and and and they end up doing great harm, sometimes killing the spouse or the girlfriend or whomever it might be who's been the victim of all of this.
[0:43:42] Randall Roth: What should be done differently about domestic violence, what would be done differently if you were the prosecutor, if anything, and um tied into that, do you agree with the so-called no drop rule as I understand it where even if the victim decides, and I'll say she, because usually the victim is a woman, if she says I don't want to testify, you force her to testify, even if that means putting her in jail, uh for being in contempt of court? Now I've asked a lot, that's one of my flaws. David Arakawa, what do you think about what you as prosecutor can you, can you do about domestic violence and this so-called no drop rule?
[0:44:21] David Arakawa: Randy, I think the problem of domestic violence is a very tragic one. I've um dealt with families who have been victims of of domestic violence and and it's really terrible. It breaks up the family, it has a scarring and lasting impact on the children. Almost everyday in the newspaper, we read about a domestic violence situation that ends up in a murder. 29% of the murders in this state are tied to domestic violence. I agree with the current prosecutor's office policy of not dropping cases when the witness wants to withdraw their case.
[0:44:58] David Arakawa: Um at the present time, when a when a um victim makes a complaint to the police, the police have them fill out a report in their own handwriting and signed, um with respect to what happened that night or that day. And I think um that ensures the integrity of the system that that witness at the time of the offense was telling the truth. I would note uh quickly that there's been new funding, uh for the domestic violence unit at the prosecutor's office. It allows expansion of the unit for two more family court prosecutors, two more circuit court prosecutors, one paralegal, one investigator and one secretarial position.
[0:45:37] David Arakawa: So this is the government saying and recognizing that domestic violence is a problem and they're willing to put their money where their mouth is.
[0:45:46] Peter B. Carlisle: Peter Carlisle. Domestic violence and the no drop rule in particular. Well, first off, let me say that I agree with the funding of the domestic violence, uh, uh unit in the prosecutor's office from the City Council. In fact, I went over there and testified in favor of it. The no drop policy is already in effect. It's not only effect in Honolulu, it's an effect in other jurisdictions, for example, San Diego. San Diego has not only the no drop rule, but it also has a specialized unit of prosecutors who are uniquely trained to deal with the problems of domestic violence. We had that earlier with uh sexual assault cases.
[0:46:23] Peter B. Carlisle: We decided that vertical prosecution was the sensible way to go and in domestic violence cases, you need the same type of prosecution and you have to realize you're dealing with a situation where if the victim decides not to testify, you still have to proceed with the case.
[0:46:37] Randall Roth: Very quickly, what's vertical prosecution?
[0:46:39] Peter B. Carlisle: Vertical prosecution means that one prosecutor handles the case from start to finish. If you recall the Alloy golf course stabbing case, I was involved in the investigation. I was involved in the, uh, charging process, the actual trial itself, all the way through the appeal. That's one person from start to finish. Non-vertical prosecution is you have one person investigating the case. You have another person who charges the case, you have a third person who's trying the case and yet a fourth person who handles the appeal. That is an a perfectly acceptable method of prosecution in certain types of cases.
[0:47:16] Randal Yoshida: Randal Yoshida. Domestic violence in our community is quite just intolerable. It's not acceptable. In fact, the real problem is that cycle of violence, because you have parents involved and the their children now are exposed to the parent's, uh, violence. They in turn, when they become parents, abuse many, many times abuse their kids. It's it's that emotional scarring that has to stop. Right now, we need very aggressive prosecutions and education. We need people who are uh those offenders. We need to educate them that there are uh ways to deal with their specific problems.
[0:48:02] Randal Yoshida: And we need to also provide assistance to the victims who are uh victims of domestic violence. We have to provide assistance to them to make sure that uh they can get out of that cycle of violence. With respect to the no drop policy, uh, I think that's a good policy.
[0:48:20] Randal Yoshida: However, I think that we have to make sure that those type of cases are thoroughly investigated to make sure that there is a uh domestic violence situation because I've known on the other hand, and we have to take a look at the other side too. I've known situations where uh people have used uh domestic abuse allegations uh in family court divorce cases to make sure that they get uh custody of the uh the children. So you know, we have to make sure that those are thoroughly investigated.
[0:48:52] Randall Roth: Okay.
[0:48:52] Peter B. Carlisle: Uh, Peter Randy, if I could respond to just one thing. I do want you to know that the victims of domestic violence are being very uh ably and capably handled uh by the domestic violence clearinghouse and legal hotline. They render professional assistance.
[0:49:06] Randall Roth: Okay, and that was Peter Carlisle speaking just then. Uh, Peter, let me ask you first, what should a prosecutor do if there's a law on the books and people are seemingly violating that law, but it's the prosecutor's opinion that that law is is unconstitutional, or for some other reason just isn't valid? And I'm thinking specifically about Keith Kaneshio, uh, not applying the law against the t-shirt vendors, he felt that it was unconstitutional at one point in time and uh, and the city campaign financing rule which, which at one time at least corp council said was uh unconstitutional.
[0:49:42] Randall Roth: Should a prosecutor say, well, the law is there and my job is to go ahead and prosecute, or do you make that determination that Keith Kaneshio has at times in the past?
[0:49:51] Peter B. Carlisle: With maybe one exception, the answer is no. Your job is to enforce the ordinances of Honolulu, uh, and the laws of the state. The one exception might be as if there is such a blatantly obvious unconstitutional law that everybody realizes it's unconstitutional, go out and discriminate somebody and arrest them on the basis of uh gender, race, or something like that. Uh, that might be something that was so obviously inappropriate, but I can't think of any law that's ever been like that. The answer is, if you have a problem with the law, seek a test case.
[0:50:22] Peter B. Carlisle: There are methods of getting it before the uh Hawaii Supreme Court such as a writ of superintendence that might give you the opportunity to test the constitutionality of the law. Would I enforce the t-shirt vendor law? So fast you couldn't blink.
[0:50:35] Randal Yoshida: Randal Yoshida. What should a prosecutor do in those instances? When you talk about a test case in these unconstitutional type situations, uh, you're talking about as a prosecutor charging somebody with a criminal offense, having that person now have to defend themselves and expend, um, thousands of dollars defending themselves. I think a prosecutor has to be very responsible in what type of cases they take and who they charge as uh and trying to label them criminals. Uh, right now, if a if a law is unconstitutionally broad or doesn't meet the uh standards of constitutionality, I would definitely not only have it researched, my have my expert staff from the research division research that law.
[0:51:25] Randal Yoshida: I would seek expert opinions from the University of Hawaii, uh, maybe even uh nationally-renowned, uh, experts, uh, giving me opinions as to whether or not it's unconstitutional. If it's so blatantly unconstitutional, my responsibility is not to prosecute. We are uh taking oath to uphold the law. If it's unconstitutional we shouldn't prosecute, but what I would do is I would go to the legislature or the city council to to draft the law that is constitutional. That's what I would do.
[0:51:58] David Arakawa: If the law is unconstitutional on its face Randy, I would not I would not enforce it. Okay. The prosecutor's job is to enforce the laws of the State of Hawaii, and as a rule, we would do that. Okay, but if it's on its face blatantly unconstitutional, I would not enforce the law. I would work to change that law to make it work. Um, we also make use of experts and get opinions from the Attorney General's office or the Corporation Counsel's office.
[0:52:35] David Arakawa: Um, you know, in Mr. Kanishiro's case, he refused to enforce that t-shirt law and it went up to the ninth circuit, they rendered a decision, but lo and behold, the City Council changed the t-shirt vending or that law and, um, Mr. Kanishiro my understanding is will enforce that law as it in its changed form.
[0:52:56] Randall Roth: Okay. Um, there are so many things that we could talk about, but you folks know your own position obviously thoroughly, and by now you probably know each other's positions on the various issues quite well. What I would invite you to do without saying your opponent doesn't know what he's doing or anything like that, something about your two opponents, um, position on the issues, something that they're saying they would do or something that they say needs changing or what have you, um, that you disagree with, that that you would take a a very different position on.
[0:53:33] Randall Roth: Um, David Arakawa, does anything come to mind that that Randal Yoshida or Peter Carlisle is saying whether it's uh their approach to plea bargaining or mandatory sentences or how long a person should have to serve before they're up for parole or or anything else that prosecutors think about and and deal with?
[0:53:55] Randall Roth: And as you can tell, I'm really as a voter, I'm trying to get a handle on how I can distinguish the three of you because I I got to tell you, it seems to me that there's an awful lot of overlap, which which says something I think very loudly to the community, awful lot of overlap and I'm trying to find those ways in which the three of you can be distinguished.
[0:54:15] Randal Yoshida: Okay. Uh, you know, I believe I believe that experience in the criminal justice system is the most important broad experience in the criminal justice system is the most important and administrative experience. One of the candidates will say it's administrative experience and maybe trial experience is not that important. You can hire trial attorneys. Another candidate will say, well trial experience is the most important and administrative experience working for the state in other agencies is an important. And you're saying both. I say both and I say I have both.
[0:54:49] Randal Yoshida: Um, I have broad experience with every component of the criminal justice system as I've said, the police, the courts, probation department, Department of Public Safety, parole authority, I've worked in the legislature, I've worked for the lieutenant governor's office.
[0:55:02] Randall Roth: So, so there isn't any position that either of the two of them is taking that you think is just a a a wrong position. not wrong. I mean, they're well-intentioned, but you think it's it's just not something that would work well.
[0:55:17] Randal Yoshida: Yes. You know, because I've been involved in the system continuously um for the past 15 years and and uh I don't know my opponents can say how long they've been involved within the last few years since they left the prosecutor's office, but because I'm involved in it, you look at how I look at the crime problem. You know, there's not just one easy answer. We cannot go back to 1988 or 1981 and solve the crime problem. You have to look at different ways to solve it. You look have to look at today's problems with today's solutions.
[0:55:48] Randall Roth: Okay. Randal Yoshida, and and I'm sure this this must not be a fair question because uh I don't think uh any of you are anxious to answer, but I I really in in good faith, I would like to to understand the soft spots in each other's positions as you see them, and that would help me to try to figure out how I should cast my vote.
[0:56:06] Randal Yoshida: I think it's a good question and maybe a little unconstitutionally broad, but let me answer it this way. One of the important things that we have to really recognize is crime is on its way up. In order to really effectively fight the crime problem, you cannot have somebody learning on the job. You have to have the person who knows how the budget process, the personal process, how the uh, how an office, a major office works. Okay? And you more importantly, have to have that kind of working relationship with the police, because the prosecutor cannot do everything.
[0:56:51] Randal Yoshida: The prosecutor has to work very, very closely, hand in glove with the police. You have to have a working relationship because the police are going to do the work. If you want to make uh, you If you want to make it happen, you want to hit the ground running, the bottom line is you have to have the support of the rank and file, and I do. I have the support clearly of the police officers union, and they evaluated all of us, and they said, "Hey, Randall, you are the man."
[0:57:15] Peter B. Carlisle: Peter Carlyle, your your two worthy opponents are are resisting my invitation to uh point out soft spots in your position or or another one's position. What do you think?
[0:57:25] David Arakawa: We're not going to issues. What you're hearing everybody talk about is experience, so I'll point out what I consider to be the soft spots in their experience. David, as he's been in 15 years of criminal law, he was a prosecutor for three. That means he's been a defense attorney four times as long as he was a prosecutor, and he left the prosecutor's office in the early 80s. Randall Yoshida doesn't believe that people should go to trial because Randall has never supervised trial attorneys. If you are a supervisor of trial attorneys, and I mean jury trial attorneys, I'm not talking about misdemeanor cases or traffic cases.
[0:58:03] David Arakawa: If you're supervising trial attorneys, they need to know that you can do what you're asking them to do, and that is expose yourself to fire, have the possibility of crashing and burning. And if you don't do that, then you're not leading your troops fairly.
[0:58:20] Randal Yoshida: Okay. Let me respond to that. My opponent said that I have never supervised attorneys. That's incorrect. I was a division chief, which is the highest level prosecutor you can possibly get other than being first deputy who is right under the prosecutor. I've I've supervised the largest division in the prosecuting attorney's office. We processed 20,000 cases a month. That's supervising attorneys. That's what you need to run an operation of over 100 deputy prosecuting attorneys.
[0:58:54] Randal Yoshida: That's what you need to be having that vision to make sure that the prosecutor's office works. My job is to hire the best and the brightest, and my job is to make sure that the prosecutors have the support they need because they're going to be the best and brightest prosecutors, probably even with better trial experience and better win-loss records than my opponents.
[0:59:15] Peter B. Carlisle: Okay, David Arakawa. Just, just a short note. Uh Mr. Carlyle failed to note that I was a career criminal and organized organized crime prosecutor like himself. And I can say in my prosecution experience and in my criminal law experience, I've done cases ethically, and I've never had any problems with ethical problems with prosecution or doing uh prosecution cases. Peter Carlyle. My last little say is the reason that there's 20,000 cases processed a month in that misdemeanor traffic division is because there's so many traffic cases.
[0:59:51] Randal Yoshida: Well, what you also what you also feel to realize. This is Randall Yoshida now. What he also fails to understand is I've served in most of the divisions in the prosecutor's office. I also served uh I also handled uh the family court unit which handles felonies, including murders.
[1:00:06] Peter B. Carlisle: Okay, well, we're down to the last four minutes, actually, three and a half minutes. So, we'll give you each one minute to kind of make your pitch to to the voters out there in terms of of why you're the best candidate for the job, uh what it is that the voters ought to be thinking about, um, you know, what is it, four months from now, something like that, when they head toward that booth. Let's start with David Arakawa.
[1:00:29] David Arakawa: Well, Randy, it's very simple. I'm running for prosecutor because if your friends, your family, and your community are being threatened, you do what you can to protect them. You can just read the newspapers or listen to the news every day. Honolulu is facing a very serious crime problem. The best way I can help to protect people is by being the prosecutor and leading the fight against crime by aggressive but ethical prosecution. We need to continue to be tough on crime, and I'm ready, willing, and able to take that challenge to protect the public.
[1:00:59] David Arakawa: Others in the community have faith in my experience and abilities and have encouraged me to run for prosecutor. Before I even decided to run, I was encouraged by several judges, many prosecutors, and people working in the prosecutor's office, by many police officers, and I would note that um my other opponent, worthy opponent is not the only one that has police backing. I also have police backing and others in the community that know of my 15 years of experience in criminal law. I've never planned it this way. It was never my goal in life to be the prosecutor. It was never my goal in life to be on TV or in the newspapers.
[1:01:33] David Arakawa: Growing up, my family taught me to help people, to help improve the community and make it a better place to live and to make a positive difference in people's life. All I can promise is that I will work hard. No one will work harder than me. And with my knowledge and experience, I can lead the fight against crime, I can make a difference.
[1:01:50] Peter B. Carlisle: Peter Carlyle, one minute. I seem to have left out my police experience, Randy. I was hired by Francis Keala, Chief of Police. The chairperson of my campaign is Douglas Gibb, former Chief of Police, and Michael Nakamura, the current Chief of Police, decorated me for heroism. So, there's my police side. Okay. Let me suggest, now, moving on. 30 seconds. Giving promises about what you're going to do is easy. It's harder to produce results. Talk and big talk is easy to come by. It's harder to get somebody who's done it and somebody who can do it again. So the best predictor for future prosecutor, see what that person did in the past.
[1:02:33] Peter B. Carlisle: Okay. Randall Yoshida, you've got one minute right on the nose, go for it.
[1:02:37] Randal Yoshida: I have a lot of uh prosecution experience, I have a lot of administrative experience. That's what you need to fight the crime problem in Hawaii, in Honolulu. The bottom line is I can hit the ground running without having to learn uh like my opponents, I without having to learn how to be an administrator. I've been a victim of crime, I make I I understand what the victim goes through. I want to make sure that no one else experiences what I felt as I was going through this going through the system. The bottom line is they will know that if Randall Yoshida gets elected to be prosecutor, they will have an advocate on their side.
[1:03:17] Peter B. Carlisle: Okay. Well, I want to thank uh my guests each is a candidate for prosecutor in the county of Honolulu, David Arakawa, Peter Carlyle, and Randall Yoshida. The sponsor of the Price of Paradise radio show is the Hawaii Community Foundation. Our producer is Susie Roth. Our director of operations is Jeff Ilarry. Uh you've been listening to the Price of Paradise radio show. I'm Randy Roth. Aloha.